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gabe
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12-31-2006, 05:01 AM
Post subject: reraised pot and i have nothing (surprise!)
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#1 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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both players are tags. the only history ive had with villian is when i played him headsup in the first round of a doubleshootout a month or so ago and won.
i didnt bet flop because i didnt want to have to fold to resistance, so i checked and he bet small enough for me to call. turn bet was weird but didnt feel like i needed to draw to the river. thoughts on all streets?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
saw flop|saw showdown
SB ($1052)
Hero ($2448.75)
UTG ($4234.90)
MP ($1583.80)
Button ($1596.75)
Preflop: Hero is BB with 4 , 5 .
2 folds, Button raises to $35, SB calls $30, Hero raises to $155, Button calls $120, SB calls $120.
Flop: ($465) 3, 2, K (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, Button bets $190, SB folds, Hero calls $190.
Turn: ($845) 8 (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $275, Hero folds.
Final Pot: $1120
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Genitruc
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,463
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seems fine don't see any better line possible unless you wanna blast the flop
other possibility is c raising turn but he prob won't believe u played f d passively so I like your line best
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when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
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Phantaroth
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 505
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I don't play at your stakes but how about leading out on the flop, and maybe calling a small re raise to see the turn, then slowing down on the turn.
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spino1i
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: 25/50's f'in hard!
Posts: 893
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This is why I dont like 3-betting pre-flop with 45o
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BR now: $106900
Playing now: $10/10/20 - $20/40 NL live, $10/20 NL full ring online, $10/20 NL 6-max online, $20/40 FL 6-max online, $100/200 FL live
Goal: $125000 for $25/50 NL live
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
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seems like any hand with a K in it he would have shoved pre or folded. Would he really flat call AK/AA/KK here?
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by spino1i
This is why I dont like 3-betting pre-flop with 45o
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thanks for small stakes advice
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spino1i
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: 25/50's f'in hard!
Posts: 893
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
Quote:
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Originally Posted by spino1i
This is why I dont like 3-betting pre-flop with 45o
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thanks for small stakes advice |
I think this advice applies even at 10/20 NL 6-max. I mean I know it looks cool to reraise with trash, but I just dont feel its that +EV of a play. I mean you can increase your 3-betting range, but theres a gazillion hands that I would 3-bet with pre-flop before doing it with 45o. As played I would probably raise the flop to 750, might as well try to semi-bluff him out of the pot. Acutally I would have bet flop to begin with, not checked. But if im going to check im going to raise him if he makes a weak bet. Check-call has weakness written all over it which is not what you want with your hand.
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BR now: $106900
Playing now: $10/10/20 - $20/40 NL live, $10/20 NL full ring online, $10/20 NL 6-max online, $20/40 FL 6-max online, $100/200 FL live
Goal: $125000 for $25/50 NL live
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johnny_fish
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: donkaments weeeeeeeeeeee
Posts: 2,186
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I like 350 on the flop.
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
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When i was working on my threebetting strategy at six max, I found it was better (small stakes, mind you) to at least have a suited ace or medium pair in this spot out of position, so you have 30+ percent equity when called, and i've found that reraising with total trash works better when you have position.
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jackvance
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,910
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Renton
When i was working on my threebetting strategy at six max, I found it was better (small stakes, mind you) to at least have a suited ace or medium pair in this spot out of position, so you have 30+ percent equity when called, and i've found that reraising with total trash works better when you have position.
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A bit ago I did some closer observing of the higher stakes games and these guys are capable of raising, reraising, or calling raises with just about any two. I can somewhat understand reraising, because you can often take down on the flop, but for example I saw a guy simply call a preflop raise with 74s.. I don't understand how something like that can ever be +EV, but yeah..
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Sarcasm is your body's natural defense against stupidity
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I just don't understand what you were going for here
Why even call the flop, do you think you can stack him if you hit on the turn?
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spino1i
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: 25/50's f'in hard!
Posts: 893
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jackvance
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Renton
When i was working on my threebetting strategy at six max, I found it was better (small stakes, mind you) to at least have a suited ace or medium pair in this spot out of position, so you have 30+ percent equity when called, and i've found that reraising with total trash works better when you have position.
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A bit ago I did some closer observing of the higher stakes games and these guys are capable of raising, reraising, or calling raises with just about any two. I can somewhat understand reraising, because you can often take down on the flop, but for example I saw a guy simply call a preflop raise with 74s.. I don't understand how something like that can ever be +EV, but yeah.. |
dont be fooled... its not +EV. I can attest to that because at 10/20 NL these are the sorts of mistakes I capitalize on most.
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BR now: $106900
Playing now: $10/10/20 - $20/40 NL live, $10/20 NL full ring online, $10/20 NL 6-max online, $20/40 FL 6-max online, $100/200 FL live
Goal: $125000 for $25/50 NL live
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chardrian
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01-11-2007, 07:31 PM
Post subject: Re: reraised pot and i have nothing (surprise!)
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#13 (permalink)
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I rarely,if ever, get pms
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,524
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
i didnt bet flop because i didnt want to have to fold to resistance, so i checked and he bet small enough for me to call. turn bet was weird but didnt feel like i needed to draw to the river. thoughts on all streets?
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I guess this is the part I don't get. You raised preflop presumably with the hopes of just taking it down there by representing a biggish hand. The flop then comes pretty perfect for you to continue representing that big hand by betting the flop. Instead you check call a weak bet by the button.
I would have bet the flop.
If I didn't bet the flop, I would have check-raised that flop bet instead of calling it.
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Genitruc
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,463
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by chardrian
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
i didnt bet flop because i didnt want to have to fold to resistance, so i checked and he bet small enough for me to call. turn bet was weird but didnt feel like i needed to draw to the river. thoughts on all streets?
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I guess this is the part I don't get. You raised preflop presumably with the hopes of just taking it down there by representing a biggish hand. The flop then comes pretty perfect for you to continue representing that big hand by betting the flop. Instead you check call a weak bet by the button.
I would have bet the flop.
If I didn't bet the flop, I would have check-raised that flop bet instead of calling it. |
this is a ring-thing. you feel like you ll get paid when you hit your draw, but you don't feel like you have a lot of fold equity so you play passively.
it'd be interesting for ppl to elaborate on situations where you "don't wanna get raised off you draw". This is something I didn't understand before playing cash games and now find very obvious but difficult to define.
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when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
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