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pocketfours
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09-05-2007, 11:50 AM
Post subject: HU 5/10: 5 bet shove AJ OOP preflop?
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#1 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
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I've been facing a lot of 5 bet shoves from AJ lately by HS regulars (when playing with 100BB deep stacks). My 4 bet (IP) has been about 35BB. Why do they think a shove with AJ is profitable? What do they think I'm 4 betting with IP? Garbage?
I only need to put in 65BB to a 135BB pot (getting slightly better than 2:1) so I almost never fold. 95% of the time I have at least AQo when I 4 bet IP and I'm very happy that they keep doing this against me, just wondering what I'm missing here. Are they playing -EV for metagame or what?
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crazycrazy
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 240
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except AJ, what is their shove range against 4 bet ?
cant i t have something to do with ur other actions or they do it against other ppl too ?
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
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Well AJ is the worst hand I've seen shoves with regularly. JJ+ are obvious shoving hands.
I very rarely 4 bet in HU before the stacks get 150BB deep or more, but I got baffeled when I saw this scenario happen three times in just a couple of days.
I'm sure they do it against others as well since they can't think that I 4 bet weak (because I don't) and they can't think that I fold easily to a shove (because I don't).
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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Seems like they suck if that's the case, or are just completely misplaying you. If you get into some huge light threebet/fourbet wars AJ is an okay hand but really not very good still.
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
Seems like they suck if that's the case, or are just completely misplaying you. If you get into some huge light threebet/fourbet wars AJ is an okay hand but really not very good still.
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Yes, exactly what I'm thinking. And in these cases I was talking about there was no betting wars going on at all.
Perhaps they think I'm folding AQ because it's only 25% against QQ+, AK? LOL if that's the case.
Here is another hand from last week with overplayed AJ. This villain is multitabling 5-8 1knl - 10knl tables and he shoves from the button. Only the second hand in the session.
Texas Hold'em $10-$20 NL (real money)
Seat 3: BUTTON ($990.00 in chips)
Seat 8: HERO ($1,010.00 in chips)
ANTES/BLINDS
BUTTON posts blind ($5), HERO posts blind ($10).
PRE-FLOP
BUTTON bets $25, HERO bets $125, BUTTON bets $960 and is all-in, HERO calls $855.
BUTTON shows [ AH,JC ]
HERO shows [ QS,AS ]
I don't get it...
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crazycrazy
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 240
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if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.
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sauce123
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dizzy
Posts: 2,405
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seems kinda dumb
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I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by crazycrazy
if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.
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Yes, probably not a moron. I haven't seen this 4 bet shove with AJ more than this one time though. The 5 bet shoves are more common and make slightly more sense if they think I will fold AQ.
He can't tighten his 5 betting range to only KK+. It would mean that he would almost always need to fold to a 4 bet. Besides, you can never fold AK/QQ+ in HU preflop for 100BB.
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crazycrazy
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 240
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pocketfours
Quote:
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Originally Posted by crazycrazy
if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.
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Yes, probably not a moron. I haven't seen this 4 bet shove with AJ more than this one time though. The 5 bet shoves are more common and make slightly more sense if they think I will fold AQ.
He can't tighten his 5 betting range to only KK+. It would mean that he would almost always need to fold to a 4 bet. Besides, you can never fold AK/QQ+ in HU preflop for 100BB. |
hm. why couldnt he ? i mean just against u. he dont shove his shoving range everytime. sometime he jus call and play pots with them or i'm wrong ?
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by crazycrazy
hm. why couldnt he ? i mean just against u. he dont shove his shoving range everytime. sometime he jus call and play pots with them or i'm wrong ?
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You can't really call a 4 bet OOP and 'play a pot'. Usually better to just shove (or fold of course). The money is going in on the flop most of the time anyway if you just call.
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