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Yuck.

  
 
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pantherhound
Old 05-04-2006, 11:06 AM     Post subject: Yuck. #1 (permalink)  
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 No damn read and OOP. Is it a 'bet the turn or don't call the flop raise' job?

----HAND 18------
Game #2251153044: Hold'em NL ($0.50/$1) - 2006/05/04 - 11:52:22 (UK)
Table "Cannonade" Seat 5 is the button.
Seat 1: gislason ($75 in chips)
Seat 2: Sall02102 ($118.25 in chips)
Seat 3: Barnabee ($221 in chips)
Seat 4: dazlad ($120.49 in chips)
Seat 5: ScubamanB ($155.37 in chips)
Seat 6: Bamalam ($41.10 in chips)
Seat 7: Smiffy44 ($85 in chips)
Seat 8: 2012 ($145.50 in chips)
Seat 10: Figgel ($53.75 in chips)
Bamalam: posts small blind $0.50
Smiffy44: posts big blind $1
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to Smiffy44 [Kc Kh]
2012: folds
Figgel: folds
gislason: calls $1
Sall02102: folds
Barnabee: folds
dazlad: calls $1
ScubamanB: folds
Bamalam: calls $0.50
Smiffy44: raises to $4
gislason: folds
dazlad: calls $3
Bamalam: folds
----- FLOP ----- [7d 8s 3c]
Smiffy44: bets $7
dazlad: raises to $14
Smiffy44: calls $7
----- TURN ----- [7d 8s 3c][5h]
Smiffy44: checks
dazlad: bets $10
Luckynic joins the table at seat #9
Smiffy44: folds
Returned uncalled bets $10 to dazlad
dazlad: doesn't show hand
dazlad collects $36.25 from Main pot
----- SUMMARY -----
Total pot $38 Main pot $36.25 Rake $1.75
Board [7d 8s 3c 5h]
Seat 1: gislason folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Sall02102 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Barnabee folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: dazlad collected $36.25
Seat 5: ScubamanB (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Bamalam (small blind) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Smiffy44 (big blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 8: 2012 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 10: Figgel folded before Flop (didn't bet)
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Pelion
Old 05-04-2006, 11:30 AM #2 (permalink)  
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I think you will run into a smaller overpair who thinks you have AK very often here. Im not ready to give up just yet on that flop minraise.

Id probably call then check/raise the turn and see what he does then.
gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.

bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
 
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Myke
Old 05-04-2006, 11:30 AM #3 (permalink)  

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with 2 limpers and the SB completing, I would raise more Pre-flop here. Your current raise isn't high enough to isolate. The rather low turn bet leads me to think his hand may be weak or he's on a draw. I'd probably call the turn, and fold the river if the straight card hits the board. I don't put him on a set here and there is no flush possibility
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GatorJH
Old 05-04-2006, 12:37 PM #4 (permalink)  
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You bet $7 into a $10 pot on the flop. That screams C-bet and the raise behind it may have been probing to see if you missed with your two overcards. I would have put in a re-raise here and if he pushes over THAT you can have a pretty good feeling that you are beat.
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drtofu66
Old 05-04-2006, 01:11 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GatorJH
You bet $7 into a $10 pot on the flop. That screams C-bet and the raise behind it may have been probing to see if you missed with your two overcards. I would have put in a re-raise here and if he pushes over THAT you can have a pretty good feeling that you are beat.
When you're re-raising the flop here, what's the proper amount? There's $31 in the pot after the villain's raise, Hero has $74 left, villain has $102 left. Would $14 more be enough to get the info you need without spewing more chips in to the pot?
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Rondavu
Old 05-04-2006, 02:42 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Value bet the turn. Release to a big raise. You have to get onto 4th street in this hand without potfucking yourself.
It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
 
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dalecooper
Old 05-04-2006, 03:35 PM #7 (permalink)  
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I like to call and lead the turn. If he smooth-calls the turn, you're ahead - value bet the river. If he raises again (especially more than a min-raise) you may be in trouble... time to re-evaluate. To me it seems like you gave up on this hand way too soon; lots of players make that min-raise to test if an overpair to the flop is good.
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samsonite2100
Old 05-04-2006, 04:04 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
You bet $7 into a $10 pot on the flop. That screams C-bet and the raise behind it may have been probing to see if you missed with your two overcards.
Gator--how does 7 into 10 scream cbet? I thought 2/3-3/4 pot was pretty standard with either a made hand or air.
 
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pantherhound
Old 05-05-2006, 04:57 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rondavu
Release to a big raise.
And to another minraise? Am I then potfucked whatever he holds?
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GatorJH
Old 05-05-2006, 06:46 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samsonite2100
Quote:
You bet $7 into a $10 pot on the flop. That screams C-bet and the raise behind it may have been probing to see if you missed with your two overcards.
Gator--how does 7 into 10 scream cbet? I thought 2/3-3/4 pot was pretty standard with either a made hand or air.
You are also at the high end of a typical C-bet rainge of 1/2 to 3/4 pot.
Poker is easy, it's winning at poker that's hard.
 
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samsonite2100
Old 05-05-2006, 06:52 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Maybe it's just me--I typically bet ~2/3 no matter what I have. I usually see 1/2 pot bets as more probe bets than cbets repping strength. A 3/4-full pot bet I usually respect a bit more than a smaller one.
If you're saying you respect cbets less as they get larger, I have to question your reasoning.
 
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LimpinAintEZ
Old 05-05-2006, 06:58 PM #12 (permalink)  
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sub question to this thread that I hear discussed - If your betting $7 into a $10 pot, aren't you allowing your opponent to call (or minraise even) with a hand much worse than yours? If I have a PP higher than board I am at LEAST min-raising that bet. If i'm sitting with KK on that flop, I'm loving it - I don't want to bet so much that it's obvious i've got KK - in this case don't we WANT the 10,10 and JJ to be in there with us? I think folding is playing a bit too tight - I thought this would be a hand where we are trying to maximize its value - I would have to guess that you are ahead most of the time.
this space intentionally left blank
 
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bair
Old 05-05-2006, 07:21 PM #13 (permalink)  
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looks like 66 to me, i would definitely lead this turn
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