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Strung

05-04-2006, 05:13 AM Post subject: Was this the wrong play?

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 209

Let me set this up. UTG+1 was being an ultra lag playing 80% of hands and raising 60%. He got lucky a few times and won some stacks. MP2 just lost his stack to UTG+1 a few hands ago and was on tilt. Then this little gem came up. UTG+1 to raised big like he had been for awhile and I assumed he had mostly garbage. I put MP2 on something bigger like AK or QQ+

I expected UTG+1 to pretty much push any flop or else check and MP2 to go all-in trying to take some money back. My question is, was I correct in my preflop play? Am I better off pushing preflop and take $30 or should I of done what I did and try for their stacks? Yes a preflop push would of been a fold from them, that's how many people were countering this guy.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG+1 ($533.33)
MP1 ($134.70)
MP2 ($103.10)
MP3 ($123.95)
Hero ($121.55)
Button ($98.50)
SB ($111.70)
BB ($97)
UTG ($27.85)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A

, A

. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $15, 1 fold, MP2 calls $15, 1 fold, Hero calls $15, 3 folds.

Flop: ($46.50) T

, 3

, J

(3 players)
UTG+1 calls $518.33 (All-In), MP2 calls $88.10 (All-In), Hero calls $106.55 (All-In).

Turn: ($759.48) 5

(3 players, 3 all-in)

River: ($759.48) 9

(3 players, 3 all-in)

Final Pot: $759.48

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martindcx1e

05-04-2006, 05:20 AM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 3,614

I'd probably push PF

Renton

05-04-2006, 05:27 AM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2006

Location: Atlanta, GA, USA

Posts: 5,991

i don't cold call AA against two opps.

Strung

05-04-2006, 05:40 AM

#4 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 209

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

i don't cold call AA against two opps.

I agree with this, however I am looking at this scenario in particular with our ultra-laggy guy and guy on monkey tilt.

GatorJH

05-04-2006, 12:44 PM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: HotLanta

Posts: 3,179

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strung

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

i don't cold call AA against two opps.

I agree with this, however I am looking at this scenario in particular with our ultra-laggy guy and guy on monkey tilt.

That doesn't matter. You are still better off re-raising pre-flop and either narrowing this to one player or taking the pot.

Poker is easy, it's winning at poker that's hard.

GatorJH

05-04-2006, 12:57 PM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: HotLanta

Posts: 3,179

FWIW - Below are the pokerstove results based on an estimate of their hands.

Pre-Flop
Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

12,794,617,836 games 20.250 secs 631,832,979 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 13.7876 % 13.32% 00.47% { 22+, A5s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, ATo+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 2: 12.4436 % 11.36% 01.08% { JJ+, AJs+, KQs, AQo+, KQo }
Hand 3: 73.7688 % 72.64% 01.13% { AdAs }

---

Flop
Board: 3c Td Jc
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 20.0863 % 19.40% 00.68% { 22+, A5s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, ATo+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 2: 23.1651 % 21.87% 01.30% { JJ+, AJs+, KQs, AQo+, KQo }
Hand 3: 56.7486 % 55.69% 01.06% { AdAs }

Poker is easy, it's winning at poker that's hard.

AHiltz

05-04-2006, 01:15 PM

#7 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Coldbrook, NS

Posts: 1,589

The pot is 1/3 a buyin with you to act. Push and get it heads up or take down a nice pot.

Fnord

05-04-2006, 01:23 PM

#8 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

$45

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

gabe

05-04-2006, 01:35 PM

#9 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2004

Location: trying to live

Posts: 7,964

gabe is an unknown quantity at this point

i think i would make it about 30 preflop. its a small reraise but it doesn't need to be that big since he already raised 15bb. maybe MP2 will push since he seems like he has a great hand too.

Fnord

05-04-2006, 01:41 PM

#10 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

$30 makes it almost correct to call.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Strung

05-04-2006, 02:17 PM

#11 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 209

Well I guess I got greedy on this hand. I wanted both of their stacks and was positive I had them both on the flop all-in. Turns out I was correct but I still lost the pot.

Fnord you say to raise to $45, if I get even 1 caller don't I have to pretty much call any push on flop (or have good odds to call anyways)? $105 in the pot + push ($75 to cover me) = $180 ~2.4:1

UTG+1 flipped over Ac6c
MP2 flipped over KQo

On the flop I was ~50% to win to ~36% and ~14%. Funny thing is I lost to BOTH hands, made flush on turn and made straight on river. Money was all-in when I was ahead so can't complain I guess. Been having some bad luck in the past 700 hands or so. Two set over sets and this hand. Sucks when you are 95% on the turn and lose to a higher set on the river! Oh well, it'll come back it always does.

Fnord

05-04-2006, 02:47 PM

#12 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strung

Fnord you say to raise to $45, if I get even 1 caller don't I have to pretty much call any push on flop (or have good odds to call anyways)?

Once you put $45 into this pot, you're seeing a showdown. I like this play better than pushing because it gives a trigger-happy opponent who might not be thinking very hard a chance to play back at you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Lukie

05-04-2006, 04:12 PM

#13 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: back with a vengeance

Posts: 3,307

3 way against this super maniac I wouldn't hate pf IF YOU CLOSED THE ACTION. But there's still 3 guys behind you, and 2 already in the pot, so I really think you need to bump it up again. This guy shouldn't be too hard to double through, right?

Also, Renton, cold-calling preflop is just calling a raise and a reraise.

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