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Frizzle02

10-24-2005, 09:41 PM Post subject: Was this a wrong play?

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 56

#Game No : 2925484667
***** Hand History for Game 2925484667 *****
$25 NL Texas Hold'em - Monday, October 24, 18:27:57 EDT 2005
Table Table 65164 (Real Money)
Seat 10 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: Vickified ( $26.45 )
Seat 2: watchurstash ( $5.50 )
Seat 3: brianCallen2 ( $5.98 )
Seat 4: ginobro ( $14.50 )
Seat 7: iow158 ( $22.35 )
Seat 8: kwal7 ( $39.80 )
Seat 9: dakjones ( $53.60 )
Seat 10: Freese02 ( $23.80 )
Seat 6: savestheday0 ( $24.75 )
Seat 5: LloydHenreid ( $24.25 )
Vickified posts small blind [$0.10].
watchurstash posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Freese02 [ Qd Qs ]
>You have options at Table 65179 Table!.
brianCallen2 folds.
ginobro calls [$0.25].
LloydHenreid folds.
iow158 folds.
kwal7 folds.
dakjones folds.
>You have options at Table 65750 Table!.
>You have options at Table 65179 Table!.
savestheday0 has left the table.
Freese02 raises [$1].
Vickified folds.
watchurstash folds.
ginobro calls [$0.75].
** Dealing Flop ** [ Qc, Ac, As ]
ginobro checks.
Freese02 checks.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 7c ]
>You have options at Table 65750 Table!.
ginobro bets [$1].
Freese02 calls [$1].
** Dealing River ** [ 2c ]
>You have options at Table 65179 Table!.
ginobro bets [$1].
Freese02 raises [$4].
ginobro is all-In [$11.50]
Freese02 calls [$8.50].
Freese02 shows [ Qd, Qs ] a full house, Queens full of aces.
ginobro shows [ Ah, 7h ] a full house, Aces full of sevens.
ginobro wins $27.90 from the main pot with a full house, Aces full of sevens.
Game #2925490765 starts.

<------That was my chemistry prof.

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10-24-2005, 09:46 PM

#2 (permalink)

Guest

Posts: n/a

Good play, you have to pay off a higher boat there if he has it.

Fnord

10-24-2005, 09:52 PM

#3 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Bet the flop.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lowBoy

10-24-2005, 09:53 PM

#4 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 513

You're gold. I'd probably put in some sort of a bet on the flop though.. like 1/2 pot.

Fnord

10-24-2005, 09:55 PM

#5 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowBoy

You're gold. I'd probably put in some sort of a bet on the flop though.. like 1/2 pot.

I think I might only check that flop with AA/AQ, but if I knew that you knew that I would have to still bet it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

10-24-2005, 09:58 PM

#6 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

Bet the flop.

Hmm.

I thought about this too, but thinking about it more, I'd check behind.

Opponent expects a bet from hero on the flop because Hero has made an isolation raise and the pot is HU. So I think the opponent checks either to signify that Hero can take the pot down as he has missed completely, or to signify that he's flopped something big (presumably trips with AX), and is willing to slowplay.

If Hero bets the flop when opponent has nothing, opponent folds. If Hero checks, opponent may see a repping opportunity on the turn and you might squeeze a little extra chips out of him. If opponent has AX, you're either going to get a smooth call or a checkraise... and assuming opponent is an average $25 NL player, he's not laying down trips here at any point, so checking the flop is fine as you're going to get his chips in at some point anyway.

What about the chances of him hitting the full house on the turn?
Well, he's not laying his hand down on the flop if he has AX, so by checking, you are not changing anything.

Fnord

10-24-2005, 10:04 PM

#7 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwarfman

If Hero bets the flop when opponent has nothing, opponent folds. If Hero checks, opponent may see a repping opportunity on the turn and you might squeeze a little extra chips out of him.

If you check as a known aggressive player then you will at best get a bet/fold on the turn out of an aware player. At PokerStars that bet will probably be something gay like 1/4 pot. Then the next time a flop like that comes along and you bet it with air you've given them cause to play back at you.

Besides, Ax is paying you off here a lot and I want to get the pot build up if he's there to pay me off so I don't have to put in some really silly river action.

Finally, I really want to win this flop every time I PFR and have air. Those pots add up to more than extracting a weak turn bet in spots like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

10-24-2005, 10:09 PM

#8 (permalink)

Guest

Posts: n/a

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

Those pots add up to more than extracting a weak turn bet in spots like this.

I don't think they do. I think opponent is folding to a flop bet with nothing nearly 100% of the time. Players at $25 NL on PartyPoker simply don't checkraise bluff, it's not something that happens.

And I'd say maybe 1 out of 20-30 times my opponent isn't just putting in a weak sauce bet on the turn, he may well go for a much bigger bet in the hope of taking it down.

After all, a lot of $25 NL donks think that a bluff only works if you lay down a huge overbet.

edudlive

10-24-2005, 11:27 PM

#9 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: 100NL 6max

Posts: 623

The only hand that is going to pay you off there is Ax, so bet the flop, if he doesn't have it...then you're just going to take it down there anyway. Other than the argument of whether you should bet the flop or not, you played it perfect, he called with the very hand that is doomed to pay you off MASSIVELY in the long run and just happened to catch his boat this time, nh.

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