|
Deanglow
|
10-16-2007, 02:52 AM
Post subject: Wow I didn't know I sucked this bad
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
I misplayed this hand in so many ways. Comments on FTR are appreciated. Is this an autopush on river? Assume no reads.
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
SB ($169.85)
BB ($35.60)
Hero ($99)
UTG+1 ($111.80)
MP1 ($134.10)
MP2 ($231.90)
MP3 ($100)
CO ($84.40)
Button ($135.55)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with A , A .
Hero calls $1, 1 fold, MP1 calls $1, 3 folds, Button calls $1, SB completes, BB checks.
Flop: ($5) 2, 3, 5 (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $3, MP1 calls $3, Button folds, SB calls $3, BB folds.
Turn: ($14) 6 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 checks.
River: ($14) 9 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $10, MP1 calls $10, SB raises to $30, Hero?
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
NLHE lahooozaher
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 916
|
|
Preflop is teh suck, obv. I don't push river. I don't think he's putting in 95bbs on the river with a hand we beat in a nothing pot.
|
|
|
|
BankItDrew
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
|
|
I don't mind preflop, because slowplaying the nuts can be very profitable. ****Just don't tip your hand heads up preflop. *****
I think you played this hand the exact same way I would have. To answer your question: NO.
First of all, I do not put villain on a straight flush. Thus, I'm trying to get in as many chips as possible on this river.
Secondly, Assume villain has the  , because this is best case scenerio. assuming best case scenerio when we have the nuts = highest EV possible.
This is not a push because any half decent player has the ability to fold 70+bb in such a situation. Instead, I raise for value... raise the most amount that this player in partcular will call with the .
I would add $30.
|
|
|
|
BankItDrew
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
|
|
dude... i just re-read your topic title and first sentance. Don't tip off the results. According to your words (although lack of diction), you lost this hand.
fold preflop.
|
Girlfriend: Why are the werewolves more important than living life?!
Girlfriend: Are you on the forums doing the werewolves again?
Girlfriend: Soo... you forgot to run that errand, but you had time to werewolf? Wtf?
|
|
daven
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: soaking up ethanol, moving on up
Posts: 5,813
|
|
pre-flop = yuck, but worked out ok for you.
flop = fine
turn = checking vs bet $10 about 50-50 here. Think check is ok after the oesd completed.
River = only one scare hand right? 4h6h. Ignore the possibility, I don't mind stacking off ace high flush vs two cards to a straight flush.
Your range doesn't look like it includes the ace of hearts - AhAx, AhKx, AhQx normally raise pre, AhXh normally put some money in on turn = I doubt anyone is scared of the ace high flush. Your value bet size is fine, how much to re-raise? Pot is $64, MP has $120 left, SB $136, you have $85. I think pushing gets rid of MP, may lose SB as well. Just calling loses value. Raising $50ish more may keep MP in and SB calls or hopefully pushes. Raise to between $70 and $85.
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
don't raise/don't fold
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise?
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory?
|
|
|
|
BankItDrew
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
This doesn't explain anything, and I can't think of anything that might.
We cannot put villain on  
|
|
|
|
Renton
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
|
|
i would shove river
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
lol yes, obviously villain flopped a straight flush. are you joking spenda or are you the biggest nit ever?
and i'm with renton on this one i think...i have no problem with shoving.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
lol yes, obviously villain flopped a straight flush. are you joking spenda or are you the biggest nit ever?
and i'm with renton on this one i think...i have no problem with shoving. |
It's close really, what calls a shove on the river? Do we honestly believe anything besides the nuts are going to look us up here? Even though we have the second nuts it doesn't mean it's always profitable to raise here. Look at the hand, notice our river bet was already called, we can than believe this player to have the :Kh: which means when the SB c/r's he either has the nuts/air. That means a 3bet has zero expectation of being called by a worse hand.
Let me ask you this, if you held the Kh on a 2h3h7hJhQx board, would you b/3b all-in on the river?
Finally, I am not the biggest nit ever, in-fact I VB very light. And yes, I'm being serious about this.
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
mp1's call does not guarantee he has the .
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
Deanglow
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
The topic and statement in the post has nothing to do with results. When MP calls I put him 10h-Qh, maybe K. When SB raises I think to myself "wow would he really do this with the Kh?" Not posting results yet.
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
i would expect the straight flush to raise much larger to "make up" for slowplaying earlier in the hand.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
zook
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,676
|
|
Pot the flop, shove the river. Reminraise is fine too if you really think players are capable of folding the Kh to a shove here (which I don't).
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
mp1's call does not guarantee he has the . |
whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh
man you guys are good at missing the point.
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
mp1's call does not guarantee he has the . |
whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh
man you guys are good at missing the point. |
spenda, you based your point about 3betting having zero expectation on the assumption that the sb has to have the nuts/air cuz mp1 has to have the Kh cuz he called your bet.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
Jack Sawyer
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
|
|
I'm pushing this all day, every day, and twice on Sundays.
"Only hands that beat you will call you" The problem with this line of thinking (while it is right) is that you have to assume the other players (vilains) play perfect poker too. In this specific case, one hand, and only one hand beats me, and I'm more than willing to pay off.
SB likes his hand (anything like Jh, Qh, Kh, even Th), make him pay more.
IOW, hero deserves to be coolered for not raising to build pot/ iso/ yada yada etc. pf
|
My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
|
VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
|
Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by BankItDrew
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
This doesn't explain anything, and I can't think of anything that might.
We cannot put villain on |
I also want to note that I am not putting either villain on 6h4h
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by BankItDrew
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
This doesn't explain anything, and I can't think of anything that might.
We cannot put villain on |
I also want to note that I am not putting either villain on 6h4h |
but you are saying that the only hand that sb calls any type of raise with is 6h 4h, and that mp1 has to have the Kh, right?
the only case i can see for calling is if you think that mp1 has the Kh and that even a minraise gets folds from both players where as a call might string along mp1 for $20 more.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
Deanglow
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
Spenda if you don't put either villain on the SF then why did you post "don't raise/don't fold?" Please explain.
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Deanglow
Spenda if you don't put either villain on the SF then why did you post "don't raise/don't fold?" Please explain.
|
he thinks the sb has the sf or air and that only a sf will call any raise amount.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
zook
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,676
|
|
Remember mp1's left to act behind us and will be getting great odds to call if we do. That may be spenda's point. Meh, I still like a shove b/c there's a lot of money behind and sb's c/r is really strong.
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Deanglow
Spenda if you don't put either villain on the SF then why did you post "don't raise/don't fold?" Please explain.
|
I already explained it but I'll try to make it easier to understand. Here's some poker theory for you NL players.
Value betting on the river
It's simple, when considering whether or not to make a value-bet/value-raise on the river you do not consider if you have the best hand or not (this would be first leveling type play). You have to consider whether or not you'll have the best hand >50% of the time when called. If you will only be called by better hands a value-bet, even with the second nuts, has a negative (or zero at best) expectation.
That's the key to my entire argument. If you feel that when your river 3bet gets called (if you shoved) or raised (when you min-raise) you'll have the best hand >50% of the time, then your bet has a positive expectation. However, in my honest assessment of the situation, if you were to 3bet the river, you would not get looked up by a worse hand >50% of the time when you are either called/raised.
Even if you raise and get a fold, your raise was still poor IMO because it just further justifies my point.
I hope you guys can at least open your poker-minds and try to understand this. This may not be the perfect example to this situation, but it's one that holds merit. I could be wrong, there's no strong read on your opponents. If they're weak-tight 100nl FR regs like I assume then they're never calling a river raise with the Kh. It's pretty obvious by the time you 3bet the river that the Kh isn't good.
|
|
|
|
givememyleg
|
|
WHO YA GONNA CALL?!??
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: ISHPERMING MISHIGEN
Posts: 5,042
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
lol what
|
Get your own badge! Click profile at the top and FTR Badge from the left nav.
"The Dragon in My Garage" by Carl Sagan
I say onto you, I've felt the dragon! I felt the touch of his tail, the breath of his fire, and I know without a shadow of a doubt that the dragon exists!
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by givememyleg
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
lol what |
lolreadrightaboveyourpostjackassaments
|
|
|
|
givememyleg
|
|
WHO YA GONNA CALL?!??
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: ISHPERMING MISHIGEN
Posts: 5,042
|
|
also with no reads on the table, a limp rr is bad. i dont really like limp rr anyway really
|
Get your own badge! Click profile at the top and FTR Badge from the left nav.
"The Dragon in My Garage" by Carl Sagan
I say onto you, I've felt the dragon! I felt the touch of his tail, the breath of his fire, and I know without a shadow of a doubt that the dragon exists!
|
|
givememyleg
|
|
WHO YA GONNA CALL?!??
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: ISHPERMING MISHIGEN
Posts: 5,042
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by givememyleg
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
don't raise/don't fold
|
why on earth wouldn't you raise? |
because I understand poker theory? |
lol what |
lolreadrightaboveyourpostjackassaments |
meh
|
Get your own badge! Click profile at the top and FTR Badge from the left nav.
"The Dragon in My Garage" by Carl Sagan
I say onto you, I've felt the dragon! I felt the touch of his tail, the breath of his fire, and I know without a shadow of a doubt that the dragon exists!
|
|
PapalRage
|
|
Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Notre Dame
Posts: 309
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
I already explained it but I'll try to make it easier to understand. Here's some poker theory for you NL players.
Value betting on the river
It's simple, when considering whether or not to make a value-bet/value-raise on the river you do not consider if you have the best hand or not (this would be first leveling type play). You have to consider whether or not you'll have the best hand >50% of the time when called. If you will only be called by better hands a value-bet, even with the second nuts, has a negative (or zero at best) expectation.
That's the key to my entire argument. If you feel that when your river 3bet gets called (if you shoved) or raised (when you min-raise) you'll have the best hand >50% of the time, then your bet has a positive expectation. However, in my honest assessment of the situation, if you were to 3bet the river, you would not get looked up by a worse hand >50% of the time when you are either called/raised.
Even if you raise and get a fold, your raise was still poor IMO because it just further justifies my point.
I hope you guys can at least open your poker-minds and try to understand this. This may not be the perfect example to this situation, but it's one that holds merit. I could be wrong, there's no strong read on your opponents. If they're weak-tight 100nl FR regs like I assume then they're never calling a river raise with the Kh. It's pretty obvious by the time you 3bet the river that the Kh isn't good.
|
I think you are confusing your own argument here spenda. You say "If you feel that when your river 3bet gets called (if you shoved) or raised (when you min-raise) you'll have the best hand >50% of the time, then your bet has a positive expectation. " But discounting the possibility of either villian holding 6h4h, we will assuredly have the best hand > 50% of the time when they call or raise our 3-bet (note we dont have to get called > 50% of the time). The bet then clearly has a positive expectation. If you want to argue that we gain more by letting MP1 call the additional 20 that may have some merit but i dont think that is what you are trying to say.
Also, while while most regs will not call a 3-bet on the river with the Kh, we have to give our opponents a chance to let their suckage show. Ive seen much worse calls even at 200nl. If you adamantly believe a 3-bet will never get called by a Kh then a raise or call has no effect on our EV because then surely MP1 will fold their 10-Q h anyways.
and, fwiw, im also discounting 6h4h because i think the villian would have check/pushed trying to catch someone with the Ah.
|
|
ndultimate.
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
is it results time yet?
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
Deanglow
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
I ended up tanking for a minute and just calling. MP folded and sure enough the SB showed the Kh.
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Deanglow
I ended up tanking for a minute and just calling. MP folded and sure enough the SB showed the Kh.
|
boooo
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
daven
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: soaking up ethanol, moving on up
Posts: 5,813
|
|
I love my post above even more now. Weak dude
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by daven
I love my post above even more now. Weak dude
|
same. hi-five!
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
Jack Sawyer
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
|
|
weeeeeeeeeee
push and get coolered next time 
|
My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
|
VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
|
Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
|
|
djzcko
|
|
Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 285
|
|
Horribly played....raise pf, bet flop, bet turn and raise/shove river. As played, I raise that river every freakin' time. If he has a str8 flush, then so be it.
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by daven
I love my post above even more now. Weak dude
|
same. hi-five! |
lol you guys are being results oriented and you still don't get it. The fact that he showed the Kh proves my point, not yours.
Also, Daven, shoving is far better than raising a smaller amount, if he's dumb enough to call with the Kh he's going to call any amount, so shoving maximizes our value.
Ok, I'm tired of thinking on different levels than everyone else, sorry for trying. From now on, stock one-liners will be all you'll hear from me!
|
|
|
|
archangel95
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 55
|
|
I think this is an easy all in...
were you going for a limp re-raise preflop?
|
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
lol you guys are being results oriented and you still don't get it. The fact that he showed the Kh proves my point, not yours.
Also, Daven, shoving is far better than raising a smaller amount, if he's dumb enough to call with the Kh he's going to call any amount, so shoving maximizes our value.
Ok, I'm tired of thinking on different levels than everyone else, sorry for trying. From now on, stock one-liners will be all you'll hear from me!
|
I understand you completely spenda. I explained your point a couple times for others in this thread. I don't see how him having the Kh proves anyone's point though since the whole discussion was whether or not he would call a raise with it. Also, I think it's very possible for the Kh to call a min-raise and not a shove.
And I was joking with my little results oriented line. I know it's incorrect to say stuff like that.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by archangel95
were you going for a limp re-raise preflop?
|
obv
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
meh, minraise has to be called like 3X more often than a shove, I don't think that'd be the case.
|
|
|
|
Deanglow
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by archangel95
I think this is an easy all in...
were you going for a limp re-raise preflop?
|
No I was going to limp/call actually; I want as many people in the pot as possible so my aces can win big monies.
I understand the hand changes completely if I raise pre. One poster made a good point that the 64h would shove the river hoping for the A to call (I would anyway). That, along with the fact I have the 2nd frickin' nuts makes this a raise.
|
|
|
|
Jay67s
|
|
Straight
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 241
|
|
[quote="Deanglow"]
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by archangel95
I think this is an easy all in...
were you going for a limp re-raise preflop?
|
No I was going to limp/call actually; I want as many people in the pot as possible so my aces can win big monies.
level???
|
|
|
|
spoonitnow
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
|
|
I flat call the river for the overcall. The Kh should be able to fold if you re-raise.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
|
|
|
martindcx1e
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
I flat call the river for the overcall. The Kh should be able to fold if you re-raise.
|
and anything less should be able to fold to the raise and a call. i think the Kh calls a raise way more often than mp1 overcalls.
|
|
Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
|
|
archangel95
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 55
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Deanglow
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by archangel95
I think this is an easy all in...
were you going for a limp re-raise preflop?
|
No I was going to limp/call actually; I want as many people in the pot as possible so my aces can win big monies.
I understand the hand changes completely if I raise pre. One poster made a good point that the 64h would shove the river hoping for the A to call (I would anyway). That, along with the fact I have the 2nd frickin' nuts makes this a raise. |
What else do you limp reraise to balance your range?
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
|
|
wait, the limp/call isn't a level?
|
|
|
|
Deanglow
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
|
|
I really only limp reraise AA/KK and sometimes AK. Yes I was planning on LRR.
|
|
|
|
daven
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: soaking up ethanol, moving on up
Posts: 5,813
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Also, Daven, shoving is far better than raising a smaller amount, if he's dumb enough to call with the Kh he's going to call any amount, so shoving maximizes our value.
|
depends if you get two callers, or if the raise inspires villain to push.
As for your post, I think it is one of the better I've seen, I read it and hear what you are saying - I'm just not certain that this is the best hand example, a point you made yourself.
as for being results orientated, I would have said the same if villain had shown the straight flush - it doesn't the thoughts behind my original post.
Value betting is interesting, when someone calls a pot-raise I often wonder if I should have pushed, when someone folds to a push I often wonder if I should have raised smaller. And value betting with the second nuts is even more interesting...
|
|
|
|
wufwugy
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,660
|
|
I kind of agree with Spenda. Nobody wants to pay off without the ace high flush on four-flush boards, and a 3bet reps that or better.
However, we're not really afraid of the straight flush. We should probably then shove and let Kh deliberate. No stats or reads were given, and some players will pay off with less here. Unknowns of a reg should be considered moderately fishy at the least.
|
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
Linear Mode
