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will a lesser hand call this

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Chopper

08-09-2007, 03:43 AM Post subject: will a lesser hand call this

#1 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

i hear that all the time, and am having trouble with the right situation to raise w/o putting myself in the situation where the only callers have me crushed.

this cant be another one, but i was worried about KQ. opinions?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($18.85)
Button ($14.40)
SB ($26.80)
BB ($23.50)
UTG ($12.95)
UTG+1 ($11.15)
MP1 ($14.50)
MP2 ($24.45)
MP3 ($36.50)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A

, K

.
UTG calls $0.25, UTG+1 calls $0.25, MP1 calls $0.25, 1 fold, MP3 calls $0.25, Hero raises to $1, 1 fold, SB calls $0.90, 1 fold, UTG calls $0.75, UTG+1 calls $0.75, MP1 folds, MP3 calls $0.75.

Flop: ($5.50) K

, 5

, 7

(5 players)
SB checks, UTG bets $0.75, UTG+1 folds, MP3 folds, Hero calls $0.75, SB calls $0.75.

Turn: ($7.75) Q

(3 players)
SB checks, UTG bets $1.5, Hero raises to $3, SB folds, UTG calls $1.50.

River: ($13.75) 5

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $9, UTG calls $8.20 (All-In).

Final Pot: $30.15

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

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ChrisBCritter

08-09-2007, 12:01 PM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: Falmouth, ME

Posts: 781

25NL... Your PFR needs to be larger with all those limpers, $1.75 at least... Raise the flop. I mean come-on. .75 into a 5.50 pot? how weak is that? UTG has half a buy in. I'll felt shorty with TPTK all the time. I only want to pay attention to SB, see what he's all about.

Turn Min-raise? ewwww. Was that for value? Stick a raise with some FE out there!

River is fine. Though, as played, I probably check behind here...

Will a lesser hand call that? Yes, all the time at 25NL...KJ, KT, K9, AQ, QJ, QT are all hands that you beat that are in his range that he "can" call with.

Hey knucklehead! Bonk!

Deanglow

08-09-2007, 02:40 PM

#3 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2007

Location: lol

Posts: 2,443

Raise preflop to $2. As played, raise flop to $4, you are most likely way ahead here. Minraise turn is horrible. Yes you do beat a lot of hands.

Chopper

08-09-2007, 05:09 PM

#4 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

i dont think we see the same things at 25NL. how long has it been since you played there? K-weak beats your ass and you never see it coming here all the time...not that i was particularly worried about it.

yes, the minraise on turn was for value. at the time, it was down to 3-way, and the 3rd folded to the silly donk raise.

and the reason for not raising AKs bigger pf, was no one was going anywhere for any bets at this table. with AKo, i pound the hell out of that pf, but with soooooted nuts, i look to string crappy flush draws along all the time.

when you see a lack of respect for pfr's, you must, imo, go ultra-expensive or cheap. you can raise a much wider range, imo, if you raise softly. if you raise bigger, you have to be a lot better post flop, and i am not that great there, yet.

and he had KJ.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Fnord

08-09-2007, 05:34 PM

#5 (permalink)

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Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,336

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Calling on the flop is really silly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

ChrisBCritter

08-12-2007, 09:40 PM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: Falmouth, ME

Posts: 781

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chopper

...and the reason for not raising AKs bigger pf, was no one was going anywhere for any bets at this table. with AKo, i pound the hell out of that pf, but with soooooted nuts, i look to string crappy flush draws along all the time...

Your logic eludes me here... If no one is going anywhere PF, then I'm DEFINITELY getting more of my money in when I'm likely to be ahead... You're just asking for trouble letting weaker hands call for next to nothing so that they can out draw you. This hand was out of control, and you were reasonably lucky to get paid off on it.

bode

08-12-2007, 10:37 PM

#7 (permalink)

Straight Flush

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Location: slow motion

Posts: 4,270

bode is an unknown quantity at this point

overall this hand is played horribly. Raise to $2 pre. Raise the shit out of that weak ass flop bet. Dont min-raise the turn. Doing this will get you AI (where you want to be here) on the turn.

Quote:

eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.

Vrax

08-12-2007, 11:03 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: Poland

Posts: 632

Top pair + lots of opponents + deep stacks = lots of gross spots.

Don't worry about SB, just pop it at least to $5, then commit those halfstacks on turn.

Your flop raise will accomplish two things:

- it'll encourage SB to fire right away if he has you crushed (if he cold calls - he is very strong or very stupid)
- it'll make busting halfstack easier

"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy

Pelion

08-13-2007, 12:03 AM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 3,206

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisBCritter

Turn Min-raise? ewwww. Was that for value? Stick a raise with some FE out there!

whaaaaaa? Pick a hand that we want to fold on this board that we actually have some fold equity against. We raise more because we are ahead almost all of the time and because we expect him to call when we are ahead.

On this board about the best hand we beat is KJ. About the worst hand that beats us is KQ. We raise because we have 0 fold equity against KJ even with a raise.

If we had 100% fold equity against KJ, but 0% fold equity against KQ (i.e. more fold equity) then we would be far more likely to just call down since we would be in a WA/WB situation and raising would only be called by worse hands.

gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.

bigspenda73: But how much did you win?

Vrax

08-13-2007, 12:39 AM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: Poland

Posts: 632

KJ, KQ, KT, K-whatever, 68, 69, hell even 99 and AQ. That wimpy probe-bet doesn't say anything.

It's 28BB pot, halfstacks don't have even two pots behind, we beat all Kings and all draws. It's not the time for making fancy handreading, where any meaningful bet is commitment against those 50BBers. Possible heat from SB may be an issue here but that's it. Just pop it on flop, stick the rest in on turn and bust those donkeys.

"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy

Chopper

08-13-2007, 02:25 AM

#11 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bode-ist

overall this hand is played horribly. Raise to $2 pre. Raise the shit out of that weak ass flop bet. Dont min-raise the turn. Doing this will get you AI (where you want to be here) on the turn.

i dont understand the $2 pf raise. $1.50 folds off everthing but JJ+/AQ+ at this level most times.

the rest i understand just fine...thanks for the honesty.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Chopper

08-13-2007, 02:29 AM

#12 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vrax

KJ, KQ, KT, K-whatever, 68, 69, hell even 99 and AQ. That wimpy probe-bet doesn't say anything....we beat all Kings

i was worried that i let KQ beat me cheaply (monsters under bed), but we dont beat ALL K's here. the 2 pair jobs have us beat. and at our level, they may be in there. i know we cant worry about that, but with the flop call (again, realizing that was dumb) two pair K's may be around...and i would have no way of knowing.

sorry for dbl post...i thought software used to auto-merge.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

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