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m3laNcholy

09-19-2005, 08:46 PM Post subject: turn play?

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 232

Preflop raise to 5BB is standard for me (and I usually dont get that many callers :P). The flop pot sized bet is also standard play, I do it against 1-2 opppents even when I have missed with AK.

THE_LUND is a regular and a solid player. I dont wanna get involved in big pot with him usually unless I hold the goods.

Notice that we both start the hand with more than $800.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hand #103070196 at table: Table TH 468
Started: Mon Sep 19 21:56:13 2005

tabak is at seat 1 with 450.20
randazzo1 is at seat 2 with 374.00
BigLou is at seat 3 with 107.20
THE_LUND is at seat 4 with 868.65
Goral is at seat 5 with 250.85
kiutsushou is at seat 6 with 896.07
shurrock is at seat 7 with 346.70
Synax is at seat 8 with 115.05
bighead1 is at seat 9 with 236.40
aannas is at seat 10 with 389.35

BigLou posts the large blind 4.00
randazzo1 posts the small blind 2.00

randazzo1: --, --
BigLou: --, --
THE_LUND: --, --
Goral: --, --
kiutsushou: 10h, 10s
shurrock: --, --
Synax: --, --
bighead1: --, --
aannas: --, --
tabak: --, --

Pre-flop:

THE_LUND: Call 4.00
Goral: Fold
kiutsushou: Raise 20.00
shurrock: Fold
Synax: Fold
bighead1: Fold
aannas: Call 20.00
tabak: Fold
randazzo1: Fold
BigLou: Call 20.00
THE_LUND: Call 20.00

Flop (Board: Jh, 10d, 5d):

BigLou: Check
THE_LUND: Check
kiutsushou: Bet 82.00
aannas: Fold
BigLou: Fold
THE_LUND: Call 82.00

Turn (Board: Jh, 10d, 5d, Qh):

THE_LUND: Bet 160.00
kiutsushou: ???

Call / raise or maybe fold?

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Fnord

09-19-2005, 09:11 PM Post subject: Re: turn play?

#2 (permalink)

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Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Quote:

Originally Posted by m3laNcholy

THE_LUND is a regular and a solid player. I dont wanna get involved in big pot with him usually unless I hold the goods.

Notice that we both start the hand with more than $800.

Sounds like a couple great reasons to raise the flop.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

m3laNcholy

09-19-2005, 09:21 PM Post subject: Re: turn play?

#3 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 232

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

Sounds like a couple great reasons to raise the flop.

I raised pre-flop, I bet the flop, he bet the turn.

Fnord

09-19-2005, 09:27 PM

#4 (permalink)

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Bahhh... misread... ok...

Push, a thinking player might put you on a weaker hand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

m3laNcholy

09-19-2005, 09:39 PM

#5 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 232

Push for $600 more on a $320 pot? What about QQ/JJ/AK of diamonds?

Fnord

09-19-2005, 11:51 PM

#6 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by m3laNcholy

Push for $600 more on a $320 pot? What about QQ/JJ/AK of diamonds?

Pot is bigger if you include his bet. Anything more than a min-raise ties you to the pot and I think he'll play correctly against that. How about the chance he's still drawing and trying to push you off a continuation bet? How about getting in your money in a spot where you likely are ahead and probably have outs? Folding is silly. Do you want to be put to a tough river decision for lots of money?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

m3laNcholy

09-20-2005, 01:55 AM

#7 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 232

Ok pot was exactly 406 at this point including his 160 bet. I have 600 left and have to call 160. If I push for 440 more here I am not going into the "call if beat" mode?

What hands does he have here that call this push and lose? Diamond draw is getting 3:1 with one card to come so I have to rule it out. Flush draw + oesd maybe but that would be J9 of diamonds...(although if he DID limp Jd9d UTG then he could have called my 5BB raise cause 3 more called in front of him.
Most likely hand that I beat here is JQ that limped then called a raise cause he was getting more than 5:1 on his money.

Now if he had QQ/JJ I am dead. I will rule out QQ cause he'd most likely raise with it UTG , he's not the traping kinda guy. AdKd I also rule out, definetely a raise.

But the main reason I dont like pushing here is that he will probably put me on AK, cont bet the flop then turn the nut straight so I lose him unless he has AK of diamonds.

So...

kiutsushou: Call 160.00

River (Board: Jh, 10d, 5d, Qh, 2h):

THE_LUND: Check
kiutsushou: ?

Fnord

09-20-2005, 02:06 AM

#8 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

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Consider that if he folds a strong draw you still come out ahead as he has had to fold a lot of equity in a big pot as well as bluff equity if a bad card hits.

Per the river:
Bet 160 if you're feeling studly. A push would be awesome as he might try to pick off a river bluff. Otherwise, check behind and re-assess table conditions (like if you really want to be playing 4+ buy-ins deep with this guy at the table.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Demiparadigm

09-20-2005, 02:43 AM

#9 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2005

Location: Party 6 max

Posts: 1,602

You can't bet 160 if you would fold to a raise, I don't think.
Although it looks a bit like a value bet, It may also look weak.
His check however is also relatively weak.
Since you showed little strength with your turn call, it would be ill advised for him to go for a checkraise.
The fear is that your 160 bet will cause him to try a checkraise anyway.
There is $566 in the pot. He has less than 600 left. You want to showdown this hand.
I guess this comes down to reads, but if you think there is a good chance of a checkraise, and you will fold if there is, you should check behind or bet enough that a worse hand may call, but will never bluff. I think about $250-300.

To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.

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