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TT w Q flop against donkey

  
 
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givememyleg
Old 07-09-2008, 04:52 AM     Post subject: TT w Q flop against donkey #1 (permalink)  
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WHO YA GONNA CALL?!??
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 PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($44.85)
UTG+1 ($75.50)
MP1 ($50)
MP2 ($49.75)
MP3 ($113.45)
CO ($29.35)
Hero ($51.50)
SB ($35.75)
BB ($51.05)

Preflop: Hero is Button with T, T.
UTG calls $0.50, UTG+1 calls $0.50, 3 folds, CO calls $0.50, Hero raises to $3, 2 folds, UTG calls $2.50, UTG+1 calls $2.50, CO calls $2.50.

Flop: ($12.75) 7, 6, Q (4 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, CO bets $3, Hero

CO is a mega whale 65/15 and plays bad bad bad. My reads on him are "small donk leads weak" (but this was only 1 hand) and I saw him c/c all the way down with Ks2s on AdJdTdAh board. Both utg's are weak passive. If I raise here I can probably get the utg's to fold a weak Q if they have it but I don't really like my hand too much. This is a pretty boring hand but just seeing what you guys would do in this spot. I'm thinking raise > fold > call...

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Keilah
Old 07-09-2008, 07:07 AM #2 (permalink)  
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I find that a ton of the time he has Q4 or something here. do with that what you will.
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daven
Old 07-09-2008, 08:52 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 you're behind here a lot, and if villain is as bad as you say he won't be finding the fold button much if he has a queen. Find a better spot.
I think fold>raise>call.
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givememyleg
Old 07-09-2008, 09:36 AM #4 (permalink)  
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 I don't think super donk will fold a queen ever, I guess I was going for too thin value or something. Super donk will call my raise with anything that even remotely touches this flop based on his prior play.

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Fnord
Old 07-09-2008, 09:46 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Hero folds and avoids sharp objects for the next hour.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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Deanglow
Old 07-09-2008, 02:28 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 Man I see a turn like 98.5% of the time. You are probably getting a cheap showdown.
 
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d0zer
Old 07-09-2008, 02:48 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 Call me a f'n donk, but I think call =~ fold > raise.

Rationale:

You have a (albeit weak) read that weak bet = weak hand. I see villains with these stats make 'probe bets' with 2nd pair constantly to 'see where they're at'. He also might be doing this with a FD or a weak queen, but I think we're ahead here enough (given the price) to see a turn and re-evaluate.

There's a decent argument for folding here though...it IS a 4-way still, and one of the EP v's might actually be holding something, planning a c/r or something.

I don't like a raise because it blows the donk off everything you dominate. It would get more value from a draw, but feeds more than you need into a Q...
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pokerfan
Old 07-09-2008, 04:24 PM #8 (permalink)  
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i call down with 99-JJ in this spot as long as its HeadsUp and his blocking bet is pretty small. I often raise with 99+ on Q high flop over a small donk bet from bad players in many HeadsUp situations. Its just too weak to fold to $3 bet with your TT here IMO. you could easily get away from this if some checking guys come over the top.
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givememyleg
Old 07-09-2008, 06:11 PM #9 (permalink)  
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 A guess a raise is too thin but villain is such a super donk that our hand still has value against him? Do we plan on calling down safe turn/rivers?

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d0zer
Old 07-09-2008, 06:20 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by givememyleg
A guess a raise is too thin but villain is such a super donk that our hand still has value against him? Do we plan on calling down safe turn/rivers?
Without good postflop reads, my default play here would be to call an equally weak turn bet, fold the turn if he cranks it up (especially if scare cards come), and call a weaker river bet.

If turn checks through I might call a 1/3-1/2 pot river bet.
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