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freechus9
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06-05-2006, 11:51 PM
Post subject: Should you ever check a set?
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: IN UR BOX HAXXING UR FILEZ
Posts: 1,000
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Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $.10 BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
Hero ($23.60)
BB ($8.83)
UTG ($10.65)
UTG+1 ($7.30)
UTG+2 ($9.60)
MP1 ($6.10)
MP2 ($8.75)
MP3 ($5.95)
CO ($11.38)
Button ($9.05)
Preflop: Hero is SB with 2 , 2 .
UTG+1 raises to $0.45, 4 folds, CO calls $0.45, Button calls $0.45, Hero calls $0.40, BB calls $0.35, UTG calls $0.45.
Flop: ($2.70) 7 , 2 , A (6 players)
Hero....
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mxiu
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 982
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I dont check here. There are 6 players in the pot, and one of them is bound to have an ace.
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rebuyman
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 70
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lead for 2 dollars.
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Irisheyes
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: over there
Posts: 3,708
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yeah bet $2.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Lead for 2.00. Enough to entice some action, hopefully a raise. But there are other times to check a set. Against standard TAggs who raise pre-flop, in a heads-up pot, OOP, it is standard to check because they will c-bet most flops hit or miss, but may just fold if you lead. I lead into larger fields, more aggressive players, or on ace high flops, but I still check at least 1/3 of my sets I would guess.
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bode
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2006
Location: slow motion
Posts: 4,270
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I know this example is in a ring game, but I had this situation come up twice last night in a $6.50 turbo and got the ass end b0th times.
1st time i raise 3x BB UTG with TT and get called by both blinds. Flop comes something like AT6. I check planning to re-raise, but both blinds check. River comes a Kh, putting a flush draw on the board, and I lead, getting called by both blinds. Flop comes xh, and sure enough, both go AI leaving me to muck my trips.
Second time the exact same situation with 88 UTG. Same outcome with spade flush and my 2x pot bet on the turn gets called by some donk w/ 57s only to draw out.
Needless to say, bet the trips hard on the flop, because this is happening to me way to often.
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Quote:
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eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.
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LimpinAintEZ
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: working myself up to FTR fullhouse status while not giving 1 solid piece of advice
Posts: 591
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lots of players here, i would lead like they all say - This is a PERFECT flop for a set, and i'm guessing you are getting paid off here...My usual line for a set is this - If I'm EP and just call a late position raiser, I will usually check or bet weak (like i have mid pair or some crap like that), hoping for the ck-raise (basically hoping that he has top pair or overpair and starts to "protect" his hand) - If i'm in Late position and the flop is checked to me, I will try to initiate some betting...More players, the more you want to bet simply because someone is going to have part of the flop - But a rainbow flop with no straight draws against 6 players...that is a dream situation - definitely lead and hope you get raised by Ax
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LimpinAintEZ
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: working myself up to FTR fullhouse status while not giving 1 solid piece of advice
Posts: 591
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do you check 1/3 of your sets? does it matter if it's bottom set or top set? Maybe i'm playing with so many clueless players, but I rarely find the need to check - If I flop top set on a rainbow I will try to slowplay, but even then sometimes I would rather bet it and see if I have any action...What I find is that most times I flop top set and slow play, people never pay me off anyway (even really bad players need something to call with)...but when I lead out, either overbetting or underbetting, I get called more often because it looks either weak or like i'm stealing - In both cases they don't put me on a set because why would I be betting if i had that good of a hand (is what i'm guessing they think) - I guess there are very few times I would advocate slowplaying a set - Maybe in bigger games you need to slowplay more because there will be more players willing to try and steal...? if you have 4 players in a pot though, the turn can bring all kinds of help to crappy hands...The worst thing to do is slowplay a set only to let someone catch a nice draw on the turn, and just when he's re-raising all in on the river you think "he didn't really call me with a runner runner flush draw, did he?" well, he wouldn't have, if you hadn't given him free cards...But maybe bigger games just evolve way past that line of thinking....
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Limpin - the important thing to remember is that like most things in poker, this is very situational. Like I said I would frequently check a set if I were first to act, heads up on the flop, against a TAgg player who had raised pre-flop and who I knew was likely to c-bet but unlikely to raise me on a bluff. That's a very specific situation and a pretty specific read, but this comes up quite a bit, especially when you play short-handed or heads-up games. Into larger fields, or if I was the one that raised pre-flop, or in position, I'm betting a set basically every time. The only question then is how much to bet. That is usually determined by the caliber of the other players in the hand, and what the board looks like.
Bode-ist - don't ever let fear of losing a pot drive your actions in poker. Your main goal in poker is to make your opponent make mistakes, the bigger the better. And the most common mistake is calling a bet when they aren't getting the odds (pot odds, implied odds, or otherwise) to win the hand. Slowplaying one street and then overbetting another to "protect your hand" is classic bad poker. My ideal situation every time I hit a set would be to bet 3/4 pot on the flop and turn and have someone calling all the way down with flush draw, straight draw, or overpair. More power to them if they want to chase. Then you just need to be smart enough to get a cheap showdown or fold when they suck out.
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