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QQ Win with ultimate bs board(tm), right play?

  
 
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Telepath
Old 12-25-2005, 04:52 PM     Post subject: QQ Win with ultimate bs board(tm), right play? #1 (permalink)  
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Telepath
Everest Poker — Hand Details
Hand ID: 131279978
Table ID: -5828496
Play Mode: Real
Table Name: Moroni-2
Game Type: Hold'em
Blinds: $0.50/$1.00
Stakes: $1.00/$1.00
Currency: USD
Starting Date: 2005-12-25 GMT
Starting Time: 15:20:47 GMT



Seating Arrangement:

Slarco is at seat 1 with $32.40.
MesiaH is at seat 2 with $165.08.
nostra is at seat 3 with $118.70.
Telepath is at seat 4 with $200.56.
jackierippa is at seat 5 with $104.47.
teemike is at seat 6 with $17.78.
Teamtaz is at seat 7 with $2.56.
dame-chance is at seat 8 with $72.32.
Probi is at seat 9 with $12.73.
NastyNik is at seat 10 with $99.00.

Post Blinds:

The button is at seat 2.
nostra posts the small blind of $0.50.
Telepath posts the big blind of $1.00.

Deal Pocket Cards:

Slarco: -- --
MesiaH: -- --
nostra: -- --
Telepath: Qc Qs
jackierippa: -- --
teemike: -- --
Teamtaz: -- --
dame-chance: -- --
Probi: -- --
NastyNik: -- --

Pre-flop:
jackierippa calls $1.00.
teemike folds.
Teamtaz folds.
dame-chance folds.
MesiaH says "omg turn the music down"
Probi calls $1.00.
NastyNik folds.
Slarco folds.
MesiaH folds.
nostra calls $0.50.
Telepath says "music?"
Telepath says "lol"
jackierippa says "river ftw"
MesiaH says "on turn and river"
Telepath says "haha"
Telepath raises $5.56.
jackierippa calls $5.56.
Probi folds.
nostra calls $5.56.


Flop (Ac 4d Ah):
nostra checks.
Telepath says "hmmmm"
Telepath says "heheh"
Telepath raises $10.00.
jackierippa calls $10.00.
nostra folds.


Turn (Ac 4d Ah 4c):
Telepath checks.
jackierippa checks.


River (Ac 4d Ah 4c 8c):
Telepath says "ok cmon blow me away"
Telepath checks.
jackierippa raises $10.00.
jackierippa says "how :/"
Telepath says "have to call"
Telepath calls $10.00.


Showdown:
jackierippa shows Js Jc.
jackierippa has 8c Js Jc Ac Ah: Two Pair
Telepath shows Qc Qs.
Telepath has 8c Qc Qs Ac Ah: Two Pair


Pot Summary:
Total Pot: $60.68
Telepath wins $58.26.
House Rake: $2.42

Is this ok??

Is checking the turn ok? Should I keep valuebetting even on a two-paired board??

I'm not really sure about this one.

T.
No limit Hold'Em - hours of boredom followed by moments of sheer terror.
 
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Pelion
Old 12-25-2005, 05:06 PM #2 (permalink)  
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I check the river.

This really isnt an ultimate bs board. If you hold KK/QQ it is much worse for you if 1 A comes than if 2 A comes. If 2 aces come you know it is pretty unlikly (but by no means impossible) that someone has another A.
If 1 A comes then only 1 out of the other 3 A have to be out and they will be ahead of you anyway. When that second 4 comes i dont think you have anything more to worry about here. Unless he just hit quads with 44 what hand does that 4 improve that would have called such a big bet preflop. and on the flop. A4....? probably not 46s.... still pretty unlikely. I think it is fairly easy to put him on an underpair here after he checks the turn and then bets the river when you show weakness but i still dont want to put my whole stack on it and he may try to bluff me off.
Whether or not i bet the river becomes a question of stack sizes and how passive your opponent is. If there is a chance he will come over the top of me I check behind. If hes short stacked im happy to play for stacks on the river. He isnt. If he doesnt ever bluff raise then value bet the river. Against passive oponents it is probably correct to make a small reraise that he will have to call with medium PPs.
However if you judge him wrong and he bluffs you off you lose a $50 pot for the cost of the $10 extra you "could" win so i probably just call anyway unless i REALLY know my opponent
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Telepath
Old 12-25-2005, 05:16 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Anyone who feels I should've been able to get more value out of this one?

T.
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Miffed22001
Old 12-25-2005, 07:29 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telepath
Anyone who feels I should've been able to get more value out of this one?

T.
me
Does the trips really check behind here on the turn, missing great value?
At least he'd min bet of some sort to try and keep you interested, so i think you missed a miniraise opertunity on the river. Opp has to be quite sure you dont have an ace which leaves it possible JJ may be good.
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Symbolic
Old 12-26-2005, 04:41 AM #5 (permalink)  

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Im happy calling this and raking the pot out of position. Plenty of people check the turn trying to induce a bluff on the river.
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UG
Old 12-26-2005, 06:28 AM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Telepath
Anyone who feels I should've been able to get more value out of this one?

T.
me
Does the trips really check behind here on the turn, missing great value?
At least he'd min bet of some sort to try and keep you interested, so i think you missed a miniraise opertunity on the river. Opp has to be quite sure you dont have an ace which leaves it possible JJ may be good.
Umm, hi. On the turn any random ace would have a full house and would be a fool to bet here.

Betting here by anyone would show way too much strength with this board. The only hands that call a bet on the turn either a) have an ace and have made hand already, or b) have a strong hand and are HOPING you don't have an ace.

An ace checks here and value bets the river, exactly like he did.

A guy with QQ crying-calls the river hoping against all hope that this guy doesn't have an ace.

A guy with QQ doesn't raise or reraise that turn or river because the only hand that calls him (usually) has an ace and will kick your ass.

Me thinks this was well played.


 
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Miffed22001
Old 12-26-2005, 03:07 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate George
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Telepath
Anyone who feels I should've been able to get more value out of this one?

T.
me
Does the trips really check behind here on the turn, missing great value?
At least he'd min bet of some sort to try and keep you interested, so i think you missed a miniraise opertunity on the river. Opp has to be quite sure you dont have an ace which leaves it possible JJ may be good.
Umm, hi. On the turn any random ace would have a full house and would be a fool to bet here.

Betting here by anyone would show way too much strength with this board. The only hands that call a bet on the turn either a) have an ace and have made hand already, or b) have a strong hand and are HOPING you don't have an ace.

An ace checks here and value bets the river, exactly like he did.

A guy with QQ crying-calls the river hoping against all hope that this guy doesn't have an ace.

A guy with QQ doesn't raise or reraise that turn or river because the only hand that calls him (usually) has an ace and will kick your ass.

Me thinks this was well played.
we differ on opinion but i recognise the thinking here!
I'll agree to disagree
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Fnord
Old 12-26-2005, 07:25 PM #8 (permalink)  
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You're giving Ax (without a boat or King kicker) too much credit for being a thinking player if you think he plays his hand like this.

I think this hand is ok. Not a spot where we're happy putting in lots of money.
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