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Laeelin
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09-10-2005, 01:47 AM
Post subject: Playing TPTK...
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,137
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Your in MP with AQ, You raise 4XBB and get 2 callers.
Flop is QJ7 rainbow. You bet 8BB. get one fold, and one reraise of 20BB.
Against most players I fold here.
Is that the right move?
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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The only hand that your beating and is a possibility he called you is KQ. Yes it is the right move unless you're playing at micro limits, where you may want to make this call.
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Checkways
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09-10-2005, 11:52 AM
Post subject: Re: Playing TPTK...
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#3 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 249
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Laeelin
Your in MP with AQ, You raise 4XBB and get 2 callers.
Flop is QJ7 rainbow. You bet 8BB. get one fold, and one reraise of 20BB.
Against most players I fold here.
Is that the right move?
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Is that 20BB more? Or 12BB more? 20BB is pretty serious and probably warrants a fold. But 12BB more... Well... A LOT of aggro players will raise your cont bet with their TP just to see if you're serious. If you're laying this hand down everytime, then you could be losing a lot of money. If you have position on this guy I'd call just to see if he's got the QJ or the 77, because honestly, that's probably the only thing beating you right now. If you're out of position then fold or reraise. Fold is obviously the more cautious way to go. But remember, this advice is a based on no reads.
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Pingviini
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 1,090
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Reads are also really important. Why would he be re-raising so much? Is he really that terrified of straight draw or just trying to buy the pot with lesser holdings.. Normally I fold here, another option is to re-raise him for information, calling is the worst option!
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"Poker is a simple math game" -Aba20
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SinkRox
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Brighton, UK
Posts: 624
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if u raise 4BB preflop the pot at flop is ~16bb, so a 4bb raise at the flop looks like a weak prob bet.. i think you should bet more 2/3 pot size - then u can take a re-raise more seriously.
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Experimenting - 200NL 5max.
"They say that dreams are real only as long as they last. Couldn't you say the same thing about life?" Waking life
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Rondavu
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,053
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When you're out of position, you need to represent the flop hard if you choose to represent it. That means if the pot is 12xBB, then bet 12 or more BB. Anything less sends mixed signals and erases your reads. In other words it opens up a wide array of hands that will make a move on you. QT, Q9, Draws, Bluffs.
Repping a flop correctly allows you the luxury of pairing down possibilities. Rep it correctly and an opponent with QT will hesitate before acting. Rep it improperly and they become more aggressive, effectively representing a better hand than they actually have, and forcing you to put them on it. Remember what your opponent thinks you have. It's important. Sometimes you need to tell them what you have so they throw out the possibility of having some kind of fold equity on you.
A good rule of thumb I use... if my goal is to take down the pot now, I expose my strength immediately, and with complete disregard for concealment. I'm not looking for more chips from my opponent at this point. I want them scared, and I want them out.
Other than that if you rep that flop correctly and get raised anyway, then just fold it without emotion. I'll always allow someone to make one or two moves on me before I decide to fight back, especially in cash game. Most people at mid levels don't even have moves unless they're a maniac. Maniacs pay you off eventually anyway. So why lose chips to a better hand that is probably just letting you know it's time to fold? If it's not a better hand, then chances are it's a player you'll be busting soon enough.
Not respecting raises is a newbie mistake. You have to learn to respect all raises, before gaining the right kind of reads to fight back against the few premium players who make gorgeous moves on you.
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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face
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Straight
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 187
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As a sidenote: if you do decide to fold to a reraise here, you should do it relatively quickly. Never ever let on that you're making a big laydown. If someone figures out they can get you to lay down TPTK on a relatively non-scary board, you are going to be facing a lot more difficult decisions at this table. I think quickly fold here without reads, and keep an eye on the player who reraised you. Does he reraise cont. bets often? Is he generally aggro? Is he changing gears or just betting and raising a lot? If you decide he's a maniac, I think TPTK is a fine hand to get it all in on, preferably using the rope-a-dope on the guy and letting him give you his stack.
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kdm3nac3
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21
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Same thing happened to me, but I had a good read on the guy so I called his all-in.
6xBB
Me: AQs, Q 10 4 rainbow flop.
He bet: $4
I reraise to: $16
Calls me all in: $30
Calls dude had A J, rivered me w/ a K
I love that.. dont know if that was good play but like I said I had a read on the guy and I knew he was buying the pot (*kinda).
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I h8 online poker.
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