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Playing back at an aggressor 200NL

  
 
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Vi-Zer0Skill
Old 02-12-2007, 05:46 AM     Post subject: Playing back at an aggressor 200NL #1 (permalink)  
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 History: SB is very aggressive. I have folded most of the time to his flop bets, initially because i didn't know how aggressive he was playing and later because i really was holding garbage. I have been playing tight, and the only hand i have taken to showdown was a set (flopped with 6-6, bet out).

I am looking for some comments on the sizing of my bets, the appearance of my bets to villain (does it look like i have a jack?), and if anyone thinks villain would think i am playing back at him. Does anyone think villain has J-x more often than 5-5+ or nothing?

Hold'em No Limit ($1/$2)

Seat 1: (SB) ($257.25 in chips)
Seat 3: (BB) Hero ($224.30 in chips)
Seat 4: ($220.15 in chips)
Seat 5: ($427.15 in chips)
Seat 6: ($129.65 in chips)
Seat 7: ($99.65 in chips)
Seat 8: ($125.95 in chips)
Seat 9(Button): ($197 in chips)

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero[5s 6s]
6 folds
Seat 1: raises $4 to $6
Hero: calls $4
*** FLOP *** [Jh 4c Js]
Seat 1: bets $8
Hero: raises $10 to $18
Seat 1: raises $14 to $32
Hero: raises $22 to $54
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Ash256
Old 02-12-2007, 12:56 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 Why would a J or 55 fourbet this flop?
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seoul_child1
Old 02-12-2007, 01:01 PM #3 (permalink)  
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55 Wouldn't... but 44 Most Definately would... IMO, this is just a horrible spot to playback...
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Phantaroth
Old 02-12-2007, 01:43 PM #4 (permalink)  
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if your gonna re-raise again id push.... but I think its a bad idea either way.
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bode
Old 02-12-2007, 01:58 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 i dont like it. why would villain think you are playing back if you havent been in a hand w/ him. I really dont see the correlation w/ 55 either. this could be any PP not believing you have a J too.
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Miffed22001
Old 02-12-2007, 05:12 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 hello spewsville. Just wait for a hand or start playing back preflop more. This sounds like exactly how i play and youve made exactly the mistake i want...
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Vi-Zer0Skill
Old 02-12-2007, 10:53 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 thanks for the comments. I probably should've tossed in my hand after he reraised my raise. Is the best strategy when playing against a very aggressive opponent simply to wait until you have a hand? Or if i had called the flop could i think raise the turn on a bluff?
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the nutz
Old 02-13-2007, 01:25 AM #8 (permalink)  

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Unless you feel you have a solid read on your opponent, and the flop likely didn't hit him, then don't bluff. Even super-aggressive retards are allowed to get good cards sometimes.
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Miffed22001
Old 02-13-2007, 05:56 AM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vi-Zer0Skill
thanks for the comments. I probably should've tossed in my hand after he reraised my raise. Is the best strategy when playing against a very aggressive opponent simply to wait until you have a hand? Or if i had called the flop could i think raise the turn on a bluff?
in blind battles he will constantly have position so make flops more expensive when you like your hand, but dont spew. Reraise him lots. Lead lots with hands that are junk or showdowable. Make him play poker with you.
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Vi-Zer0Skill
Old 02-13-2007, 12:16 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 I am clearly a loser, since for the last 12 hours or so i have been eagerly awaiting a chance to explain my logic at the time of the hand (i was in class when i responded briefly last night) lol. Now i am at work and have a few minutes, so here it goes...

If villain is a reasonably intelligent player (a fair assumption at 200NL i figure), when i four bet the flop he has to consider my two likely holding

1). air
2). J-x

If he is holding an overpair, say eights or nines he is in a tough spot so i would think he would defer to any information he has gathered about me.
I don't think he could peg me as an aggressive player based on what has happened at the table, since i have folded to 2 of his continuation bets on the flop.

Also, with both villain and I having full stacks, getting to showdown isn't going to be cheap for him and he should be aware of this.

Why did i minraise the flop on my 4bet? The biggest reasons were that with the texture of the board drawing hands weren't likely(rainbow paired) so i wasn't giving villain a good price for a draw and that a 4bet minraise looks to me like it is crying for a call or weakly bluffing. Which are the only two hands i could possibly have according to how i have bet - as i mentioned earlier.

With my current table image that of a relatively tight player i figured raising again was okay, besides the fact that it was easy to shutdown if i were to be raised again or called, since i had nothing at all and even i would'nt make another play at the pot : ).

For mathematical purposes, i think that this play works more than 1 time in 4 (getting villain to fold).


I do think there are two better ways to play this hand, however;

1). fold flop, since i played SC's and missed, i might as well wait for a better spot to play back at villain (like with a pair or draw).

2). flat call the flop and raise the turn hard, since that looks much more like what a hand with a jack would do.
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