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Fnord
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12-04-2005, 11:46 PM
Post subject: The pattern mapper told me to do it
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#1 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,334
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GAMB00LPoker&SportBook.com 100NL
Passive table with a couple really soft spots.
Mediocre EP player limps UTG+1
I follow with T 9
Horrible player follows (any 2 cards)
SB complets and the BB checks, weeee
4 to the flop, $4 in the pot.
J 9 2
Checked through.
turn is a 5
Checked to EP who bets $4, I raise to $12, horrible calls, blinds fold, EP calls.
River is a 5
Checked through.
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johnny_fish
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: donkaments weeeeeeeeeeee
Posts: 2,186
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That A5 is a real moneymaker!
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,334
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by johnny_fish
That A5 is a real moneymaker!
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I don't consider A5 to be a likely holding for either player.
Horrible is horrible, but he's not a calling station. He has Jx, big draw or 2pr+ to make that call. Although his lack of a flop bet almost rules out Jx. Medicore likes to make smaller bets with hands that have showdown value. I guess A5s fits, but that's a pretty far stretch.
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Bmxicle
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 947
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I don't like raising in spots like this against total donkeys (especially two of them) because they will call you too often for you to know where you are at. If i like my hand here (and i don't know that i normally would) then i like to just call along and see what happens on the river.
Or give me a good reason to raise here (and i'm not being an asshole, cause i struggle in these spots two and wouldn't mind another players insight on situations like this).
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,334
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
Or give me a good reason to raise here (and i'm not being an asshole, cause i struggle in these spots two and wouldn't mind another players insight on situations like this).
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The weak player migh fold a Jack to my big raise and it makes for a tigher range horrible can call with. If he plays back, he's predictable enough that I can feel really good about folding. Finally, just calling confronts me with a river decision. I think I get checked to unimproved almost always by raising the turn hard. So that extra $8 is buying me a lot of good things for my hand.
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r8ed
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,524
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78 missed their draw?
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finky
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Flush
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: London
Posts: 270
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I quite like the raise (you may be 2nd best to A9 or TT but at least you get the draws out and have a chance to take it there) but wouldn't river decisions be easyer in a small pot with less invested?
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,334
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They both had the diamond frush draw.
EP has 6 4
Horrible had A 3
MHIG
I think an orbit later I stacked someone who thought who didn't think much of me potting the flop, potting the turn and then finishing his poor pot-struck ass on the river.... out of position in an unraised pot... with a set...
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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id play the turn that way. I like my hand and id bet the river too quite hard. Your read on any 2 is good to me, if he doesnt bet the flop he doesnt have tp.
If ep player is mediocre he could limp pp, suited connectors so somehow the turn may have hit him/offered him a draw or perhaps if he had a pp it may make him think hes good.
also whenshort handed would TT be raised? same possibly with A9 or are they really that passive?
i thnk it good play in a marginal situation but i bet the river again both for value and because i think the passives have to make a tough call with posible trips on the board.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,334
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miffed22001
i thnk it good play in a marginal situation but i bet the river again both for value and because i think the passives have to make a tough call with posible trips on the board.
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I don't see any value in a river bet? What are they calling with ? Folding at this point?
The only merit I considered for a river bet is that it might freeze out horrible from making a play at the pot. However, I'd seen him play enough to figure him for the type not to take stabs at pots very often in spots like this.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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im thinking value for ep who may have a pp and like his hand after no flop bets. If he isnt that type then ok. Also, Ok if any two doesnt like to take a stab at the pot then check it don if possible.
My other thinking is that if we bet the river and try to show no fear then we could get a fold if we are marginally behind.
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