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multiway limped, WTF is this

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Keilah

06-23-2008, 09:24 AM Post subject: multiway limped, WTF is this

#1 (permalink)

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This guy's line doesn't make a lot of sense to me... villain is a 17/5/3 reg.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($106.40)
UTG ($40)
Hero ($229.85)
MP1 ($100)
MP2 ($33.05)
CO ($104.90)
Button ($149.30)
SB ($140.70)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 3

, A

. UTG posts a blind of $1.
UTG (poster) checks, Hero calls $1, 1 fold, MP2 calls $1, 1 fold, Button calls $1, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($6) 3

, 4

, 3

(6 players)
SB bets $4, BB folds, UTG folds, Hero raises to $12, MP2 folds, Button calls $12, SB raises to $139.7

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Fnord

06-23-2008, 09:39 AM

#2 (permalink)

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Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

I hate the call pre-flop, you're just asking to get position raped and with the extra blind out sooo often someone pulls the trigger. If it was a live game, I hate it less but it's probably still too loose.

post-flop, I'm really really worried about the button's range here. Is he retarded enough to play a flush draw like that? Does he over-limp his button often? If not, this is a difficult fold because you're beating exactly K3s or maybe 56spades. Throw in whatever the fuck SB is up to and I'm not supper supper happy about our equity between these two hands. People tend not to go crazy in small pots.

..all that said, you're ahead here sometimes. I'm just not super-excited about how often when there is over $100 behind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

jimmy44

06-23-2008, 09:48 AM

#3 (permalink)

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I agree the pre-flop call is meh (unless the table is very passive Pre-flop and there is a calling station after us).
I agree that button's call is worrying, but here you have the 3rd nuts!
Depending on button's stats he could easily have 55-TT.
On a vaccum I call here.

TonyB73

06-23-2008, 09:50 AM

#4 (permalink)

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Join Date: Mar 2008

Posts: 414

I'll give you my thoughts, but I'm still a noob so take them as you wish.

The hands you are scared of here are 34 and 44, and I would say that completing in the SB in a multiway pot then b/r postflop is pretty consistent with that for a guy with those stats.

On the other hand, his 4x pot shove looks a lot like a bet that doesn't want to be called. Makes me think it could be a pure bluff, or maybe a semi-bluff with something like 56 or two spades. Whether he makes a play like that here might depend on your image (and button's), which you haven't mentioned.

Muzzard

06-23-2008, 12:02 PM

#5 (permalink)

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What are you doing limping UTG+1 here?

I'm in the same boat as fnord here, worried about the overcall rather than the push. I just dont get the push at all, just looks like 3x hand that doesn't wanna see draws completing. I doubt 44 or 34 plays this way.

badgers

06-23-2008, 02:45 PM

#6 (permalink)

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Pretty wierd spot, as you say his line makes no sense as I don't understand why a draw would shove here unless it's 5s6s or something. I'm pretty tempted to make a weak-tight fold here.

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Fnord

06-23-2008, 04:54 PM

#7 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

I doubt 44 or 34 plays this way.

I don't.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

ATOTHEC101

06-23-2008, 05:47 PM

#8 (permalink)

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id call here, possible the button has 4s full but i think its alot more likely hes just bad and wants to see a turn with some form of big draw. In relation to the sb he does this with a ton of his 3s and as we have trips top kick i call. Also as mentioned limping from ep is preety bad, raise or fold imo.

Keilah

06-23-2008, 06:00 PM

#9 (permalink)

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table was like 40% loose/passives hence the utg+1 limp.

I don't know much about his image (I'm such a multitabler) but I haven't noticed him acting up or making similar plays recently.

I'm running around 16/13/3 or something on this table.

badgers

06-23-2008, 06:03 PM

#10 (permalink)

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can i cheat and ask who the reg was

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Keilah

06-23-2008, 06:06 PM

#11 (permalink)

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xxPumuckel1xx

badgers

06-23-2008, 06:08 PM

#12 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Keilah

xxPumuckel1xx

snapfold he has 44

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Keilah

06-23-2008, 06:09 PM

#13 (permalink)

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o srsly?

badgers

06-23-2008, 06:12 PM

#14 (permalink)

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damn i was going to delete that post it was too rash lol.

but i would lay this down against him. I would expect him to be calling with his draws here, he's pretty bad.

uhhhhh even that sounds bad all my posts in this thread suck sorry.

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badgers

06-23-2008, 06:29 PM

#15 (permalink)

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K I'm going to try and make a good post. Fwiw I have him at 14/4/0.65 over 3k hands so to me he's an ubernit.

I would only expect him to shoving here with nut flush draws because he's a nit etc, actually I don't expect him to be shoving with all his NFDs but we'll come to that later.

Here's his range with NFDs and OESFDs and full houses.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

16,830 games 0.015 secs 1,122,000 games/sec

Board: 3d 3s 4s
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 47.403% 46.55% 00.85% 7835 143.00 { Ac3c }
Hand 1: 52.597% 51.75% 00.85% 8709 143.00 { 44, AsKs, AsQs, AsJs, AsTs, As9s, As8s, As7s, As6s, As5s, As4s, As3s, As2s, 6s5s, 43s, 43o }

So we have only 47% equity against what I think would be his widest range. I guess sometimes he could be on tilt or something but whatever. So if you think that's his range then go for it, but I would expect it to be narrower and I would also expect him to be raising AKs preflop.

Here's what I believe a more accurate range is. I put AQs in because sometimes he'll be shoving with a NFD and overs but not often imo.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

8,910 games 0.005 secs 1,782,000 games/sec

Board: 3d 3s 4s
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 27.817% 26.75% 01.07% 2383 95.50 { Ac3c }
Hand 1: 72.183% 71.11% 01.07% 6336 95.50 { 44, AsQs, As2s, 6s5s, 43s, 43o }

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Keilah

06-23-2008, 06:29 PM

#16 (permalink)

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Dun worry badgey, hot poker-nipples still <3's you.

Oh yah I guess I should have said in OP but button was a donk, he probly has 55-88, 4x, 3x, or a FD.

badgers

06-23-2008, 06:31 PM

#17 (permalink)

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However if the guy behind was terrible I would be a lot more inclined to go for it. If he's also a nit then I'm even more scurred.

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Keilah

06-23-2008, 06:34 PM

#18 (permalink)

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I think range 2 is pretty realistic.

Amazing that my 2k sample and your 3k sample have him at such different AFs

Fnord

06-23-2008, 06:55 PM

#19 (permalink)

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AF is a stupid stat. It tries to do wayyyy too much with one number.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

badgers

06-23-2008, 06:55 PM

#20 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Keilah

I think range 2 is pretty realistic.

Amazing that my 2k sample and your 3k sample have him at such different AFs

Yeah that's pretty eye-opening. I guess hud-botting isn't all it's cracked up to be.

I think the player yet to act would have to be a complete drooler for me to want to get involved here.

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