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Outlaw
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06-22-2010, 07:11 PM
Post subject: Line with max value?
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (7 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
saw flop | saw showdown
CO ($36.50)
Button ($10.10)
SB ($9.50)
BB ($10)
UTG ($25.70)
MP1 ($9.25)
Hero (MP2) ($48.25)
Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J , J
2 folds, Hero bets $1.70, CO calls $1.70, 3 folds
Flop: ($4.15) Q, Q , 7 (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks
Turn: ($4.15) J (2 players)
Hero bets $3.95, CO raises to $7.90, Hero calls $3.95
River: ($19.95) 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $5, Hero raises to $38.65 (All-In), CO calls $21.90 (All-In)
Total pot: $73.75 | Rake: $3
Results below:
Hero had J, J (full house, Jacks over Queens).
CO had K, Q (three of a
Please critique my logic. Obviously its a monster hand but I think sometimes I take this type of spot for granted and don't play the most +ev for the opponents range.
Flop.. No bet because most of the hands I beat will bet here anyways.. 22-1010, club draws etc.
Turn.. I bink and then have to decide which line gets all the money in the most often by the river. Obv if he has a queen its easy but I am thinking there are draws I have to get value from as well. When he raises the turn I am almost certain he has a hand that I can get river value from, ie.77, Qx. I thought raising here looked bad because it shuts out draws. I am worried about scare cards for his Qx hands but I am like 100% sure I stack him if the river bricks.
River- The brick hits. So if I bet does anything raise me? I guess Qx does as well as 77 of course. But I doubt he is ever bluff shoving his missed draws. What hands definitely bet? All of the ones that call or raise my lead out. So clearly in my mind the best play is to check raise. If he was bluffing I still get the value of one river bet, and if he has qx or a worse boat, I have a chance at all of the money.
kind, Queens).
Outcome: Hero won $70.75
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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Most hands you beat will not bet but will call flop
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caddie444
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: constantly UTG
Posts: 723
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Def c-bet flop and as played prob just CIB on turn but it doesn't really matter since he's screaming strength and you'd have to really mess up not to get his stack. If he is raising on the turn with a draw (which is rare but possible) minraising gets more money in the pot when he still thinks he has implied odds if he hits and likely makes money as he'll prob just check behind when he misses on riv
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Don't complain; Just work harder - Randy Pausch (The Last Lecture)
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Paired boards like that oop are big candidates to get bluff raised on the flop... another reason for my non-cbet. If I check and he bluffs the flop, I have control of the pot.
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oskar
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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Why do you want to avoid getting bluff raised on the flop??? o_O
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The strengh of a hero is defined by the weakness of his villains.
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kmind
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
Why do you want to avoid getting bluff raised on the flop??? o_O
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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It can potentially put me in a bad turn/river spot if the pot gets bloated when I am oop... folding the best hand is something I hate doing.
Additionally, it is very tough for him to have a hand he can call more than 1-2 bets with. There are still two streets to get value from later so why screw around with getting outplayed oop.
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BankItDrew
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deanglow
Most hands you beat will not bet but will call flop
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My thinking is the complete opposite in this spot. I find it's more likely a weaker hand than JJ will bet when checked to here than call when facing a bet.
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Girlfriend: Why are the werewolves more important than living life?!
Girlfriend: Are you on the forums doing the werewolves again?
Girlfriend: Soo... you forgot to run that errand, but you had time to werewolf? Wtf?
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BankItDrew
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
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Also, let's assume villain has a draw, why not make a tiny raise back on the turn? They'll call almost always.
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Girlfriend: Why are the werewolves more important than living life?!
Girlfriend: Are you on the forums doing the werewolves again?
Girlfriend: Soo... you forgot to run that errand, but you had time to werewolf? Wtf?
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bikes
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a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,463
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LOL @ all these threads im reading being concerned with getting bluff raised constantly at SSNL FR. Jfc u are not playing 10knl 6m.
Bet flop for value obv. 3b the turn to like $12. Shove river
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surviva316
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Confusing people with my liberal biblicisms
Posts: 1,625
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are there reads somehwere in the op? i'm not being a jackass, i really dont know if i'm just missing them
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BooG690
I just wanted to share singing vaginas.  |
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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No reads
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Carroters
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Da Amberlamps
Posts: 2,216
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Induce imo
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Imthenewfish
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: sites im allowed to play on
Posts: 946
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min 3bet turn to induce imo
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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hand is perfect except for flop, and this flop line is fine once in a while anyway...
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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WildBobAA
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lol i dunno
Posts: 1,811
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outlaw
Paired boards like that oop are big candidates to get bluff raised on the flop... another reason for my non-cbet. If I check and he bluffs the flop, I have control of the pot.
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Check/calling the flop does not give you control of the pot at all. On the turn, say you don't hit your jack and he fires again. All you've accomplished is getting yourself into a reverse implied odds situation.
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Micro2Macro
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: http://three-pair.com/
Posts: 4,465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBobAA
Check/calling the flop does not give you control of the pot at all. On the turn, say you don't hit your jack and he fires again. All you've accomplished is getting yourself into a reverse implied odds situation.
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well f'in said
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"Once we reach a certain level of mastery, we see there are higher levels and challenges. If we are disciplined and patient, we proceed. At each higher level, new pleasures and insights await us--ones not even suspected when we started out. We can take this as far as we want--in any human activity there is always a higher level to which we can aspire."
Check out my blog here!
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