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View Poll Results: Your move?
Fold.	3	37.50%
Fold preflop.	4	50.00%
Call.	1	12.50%
Voters: 8. You may not vote on this poll

Laydown?

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Renton

02-18-2006, 02:42 AM Post subject: Laydown?

#1 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2006

Location: Atlanta, GA, USA

Posts: 5,991

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

UTG+2 ($14.42)
MP1 ($24.75)
MP2 ($31.83)
MP3 ($19.81)
CO ($24.85)
Button ($45.55)
Hero ($25.06)
BB ($25.21)
UTG ($7.30)
UTG+1 ($15.07)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q

, Q

. Hero posts a blind of $0.10.
UTG calls $0.25, 1 fold, UTG+2 calls $0.25, 2 folds, MP3 calls $0.25, CO calls $0.25, 1 fold, Hero (poster) raises to $1.9, BB raises to $5.75, UTG folds, UTG+2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Hero calls $4.

Flop: ($13) 9

, 4

, 7

(2 players)
Hero checks, UTG Raises all-in (19.19)

Hero: ???????

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Blinky

02-18-2006, 02:55 AM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: nutpeddlers anonymous

Posts: 459

Do you have a read on the opp?
What is your table image?

IMO these are critical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rondavu

We will not support your pocket pair aggression.

Renton

02-18-2006, 03:02 AM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2006

Location: Atlanta, GA, USA

Posts: 5,991

too early to have reads

sorry

Lukie

02-18-2006, 04:21 AM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: back with a vengeance

Posts: 3,307

You don't have odds to call for set value preflop, so if you are going to find a fold this hand on a rag board, it has to be preflop. Against any sort of competant player, i fold this preflop.

DaHorror

02-18-2006, 05:56 AM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Posts: 616

That is definitely the crux of the matter Lukie so great point. You have to think out the hand a little in advance in this tricky situation (which happens too often).
Preflop you just have to know what you will do on an all rag flop...otherwise as Lukie said, it's most likely a preflop fold and find a better spot...you already know what you will do on an A or K hi flop without your set.

That said, if you are thinking of getting his last $19, then you can still muck it on the flop with a missed set. However, if you think about it, it doesn't matter whether you had QQ, KK, or 22 when you make the preflop call if you are only calling for set value (in which case this is generally a bad call because of the poor odds given (calling $4 into an $8 pot preflop with what, 7 to 1 on the set?)...though plenty of people will do that.

I just don't see who makes this play other than AA (cuz who reraises with AK from the BB?)...if he had jacks or kings, at least a thinking player would know that you could possibly have slowplayed AA preflop and just called his reraise.

The only suspiciousness involved in the hand is that he flat goes allin on the flop - he doesn't opt for the trickier check-raise allin play. This tends to lead one to believe that he missed and wants you to go away, and that could very well be.
But at the same time, AA bets $10 on the flop and a flush card comes on the turn...he's pot committed anyway so might as well get it all in there on the flop and not have to worry about any scare cards.

So for a decent player, I only see two hands here - AA, or AK of clubs. You'll never know which unless you call or he happens to show :P

With a wackier opponent, TT-KK are certainly possibilities...hell I've had someone reraise me with 99 and then call my AA allin preflop (of course to catch a third 9 on the turn woohoo for me).

Renton

02-18-2006, 06:47 PM

#6 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2006

Location: Atlanta, GA, USA

Posts: 5,991

Posted this hand for one very important reason.

I had this same occurrence happen twice in one session of four tabling the 25nl.

The first occurrence, this one that i posted, I called the preflop reraise and folded the flop.

The second occurrence, I called the preflop reraise and called the flop all-in with my QQ. Villain showed TT and I stacked him.

Its just that weird PP donkey variable that makes decisions like this so complicated.

WhooFleuryScores

02-19-2006, 12:34 AM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Massachusetts

Posts: 918

Send a message via AIM to WhooFleuryScores

I dunno man.....def depends on the read.Against a rock or mouse I fold.Verses a maniac or maybe a fish/calling station I call.A TAG or Eagle I would def need some time.

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