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pgil
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03-16-2008, 04:03 PM
Post subject: KK in a tough spot pf
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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wasn't really sure what to do here. UTG has been raising a lot of hands from EP, but other than that seems to be fairly standard. Running something in the 15/11 range. Probably has a lot of small-med PP hands/ATs+/stuff like that.
CO is what concerns me here obviously. I don't know if he has noticed that UTG is raising too many hands from EP and is trying to take him on lighter, or if he has QQ(maybe JJ)+/AK/AQs.
Either way, what do I do here? If I 4-bet without having invested anything it looks like AA/KK pretty well every time, and isn't getting action from worse. If I flat call I am OOP (both absolute and relative) and likely to be squeezed between the button betting the flop and not knowing if UTG liked the flop or not.
any ideas of what to do pf here?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
CO ($123.35)
Button ($18)
Hero ($116.60)
BB ($48)
UTG ($129.40)
UTG+1 ($21.85)
MP1 ($90.55)
MP2 ($32.80)
Preflop: Hero is SB with K , K .
UTG raises to $4, 3 folds, CO raises to $12, 1 fold, Hero....?
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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I raise to somewhere around $36-40 and call a shove. I say this because there's enough evidence that our KK is good and I see too many people in CO's position shoving over with shit like JJ here lately.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
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dev
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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Tight spot, but we might be over-thinking this. Just raise/call AI.
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Check out my self-deprecation here!
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jimmy44
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Place where I can spew
Posts: 1,391
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by spoonitnow
I raise to somewhere around $36-40 and call a shove. I say this because there's enough evidence that our KK is good and I see too many people in CO's position shoving over with shit like JJ here lately.
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Yup! Some times even TT 
If CO is a thinking player, he might think that you think he's raising light against light PFR in UTG.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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I flat called looking to get it in on a non A flop. UTG thought for a while and called.
Flop is J high, do real draws. I am first to act, do I weak lead to try and get a little extra in from UTG before CO raises over, or do I just CRAI?
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
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rr pre is an overplay. I see no worse hands continuing.
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mcatdog
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 3,654
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This spot occasionally comes up for me in the donkaments that start 150 BB deep and I always wonder what to do.
Renton,
Considering that our hand is face up as QQ-AA if we call (assuming the CO is decent) what makes a worse hand more likely to continue on the flop than preflop? Or are you resigned to the CO giving you no action with worse hands and you just want UTG in so he can make the toppest pair and you can stack him? The OP didn't really describe UTG as a fish either...seems like calling just lets you get stacked by more hands than just AA.
Pgil,
A flop lead from you does not look weak in any way whatsoever. If I were the CO I'd snap dump QQ to it.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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I was thinking like 5-10 dollars as my lead, basically the weakest lead I can think of, just try to get a little bit extra out of him before CO makes a move. I know that any lead would look super strong, so my only hope at trapping more money in would be to make an extremely weak lead (by weak I meant size wise).
So I actually checked the flop, UTG checked as well obviously, CO pushes.......
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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Seabass
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Straight
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: trying not to die
Posts: 205
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No info on CO?
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GatorJH
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: HotLanta
Posts: 3,179
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pgil
I was thinking like 5-10 dollars as my lead, basically the weakest lead I can think of, just try to get a little bit extra out of him before CO makes a move. I know that any lead would look super strong, so my only hope at trapping more money in would be to make an extremely weak lead (by weak I meant size wise).
So I actually checked the flop, UTG checked as well obviously, CO pushes.......
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With a J high flop and no real draws would CO really push here if he held AA?
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Poker is easy, it's winning at poker that's hard.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Seabass
No info on CO?
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nothing stands out about him. haven't seen him 3bet yet, but it is early in the session. He is running looser than most FR players, and more aggressive, but again sample size is an issue. I believe I had him at about 22/15 or something like that. Seems semi aware, I say this because he is above 20 VPIP and hasn't gone busto yet after about 50 hands, and hasn't stood out as a donkey whom I should be concentrating on stacking.
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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