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Just back, what'd I do wrong?

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Knytestorme

01-23-2006, 11:13 AM Post subject: Just back, what'd I do wrong?

#1 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2005

Location: Australia

Posts: 562

Hey guys, took a little break from playing online and back now, playing good some nights, terrible others (eg up $130 over the weekend, then down $40 next day playing like a donk) but this has been the only hand so far that made me yell out "WTF are you doing in the pot".

Any advice on if I should have played it differently or if the guy would have eventually paid me off in the long run would be appreciated.

Stage #275796503: Holdem No Limit $0.10 - 2006-01-23 06:43:09 (ET)
Table: PARKGROVE LANE (Real Money) Seat #4 is the dealer
Seat 4 - KNYTESTORME ($50.23 in chips)
Seat 5 - POORMONKEY ($19.20 in chips)
Seat 9 - TRU3FALS3 ($10.13 in chips)
Seat 1 - GOODLUKALL ($35.28 in chips)
Seat 3 - AGENT77 ($13.25 in chips)
POORMONKEY - Posts small blind $0.10
TRU3FALS3 - Posts big blind $0.25
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to KNYTESTORME [Jc Ah]
GOODLUKALL - Calls $0.25
AGENT77 - Raises $0.50 to $0.50
KNYTESTORME - Raises $1.50 to $1.50
POORMONKEY - Folds
TRU3FALS3 - Folds
GOODLUKALL - Calls $1.25
AGENT77 - Folds
*** FLOP *** [8c 3d Ad]
GOODLUKALL - Checks
KNYTESTORME - Bets $2.75
GOODLUKALL - Calls $2.75
*** TURN *** [8c 3d Ad] [6s]
GOODLUKALL - Checks
KNYTESTORME - Bets $5
GOODLUKALL - Calls $5
*** RIVER *** [8c 3d Ad 6s] [2d]
GOODLUKALL - Checks
KNYTESTORME - Checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
GOODLUKALL - Shows [4d 7d] (Flush, ace high)
KNYTESTORME - Mucks
GOODLUKALL Collects $18.40 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($19.35) | Rake ($0.95)
Board [8c 3d Ad 6s 2d]
Seat 1: GOODLUKALL won Total ($18.40) HI

$18.40) with Flush, ace high [4d 7d - B:Ad,P:7d,P:4d,B:3d,B:2d]
Seat 3: AGENT77 Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 4: KNYTESTORME (dealer) HI: [Mucked] [Jc Ah]
Seat 5: POORMONKEY (small blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 9: TRU3FALS3 (big blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS

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vqc

01-23-2006, 11:15 AM

#2 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 5,427

im no cash game expert but why not just fold preflop?

im not sure how big the turn bet was in relation to the pot, but im sure something like 3/4 pot woudl be the right bet.

biondino

01-23-2006, 12:42 PM

#3 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars

Posts: 3,170

Agent77's minraise is what would make me fold. Otherwise I'd probably play the same way. What can you do - he paid over the odds to chase a flush and hit. Make sure you take notes on this guy - he calls a re-raise utg with 47s...

Rondavu

01-23-2006, 02:55 PM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 3,053

Why reraise AJ? Was there a specific read that made you do this? Was the initial raiser a chronic min raiser?

It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.

mxiu

01-23-2006, 03:06 PM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 982

Drop AJ PF to a raise.

Irisheyes

01-23-2006, 03:23 PM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: over there

Posts: 3,708

Fold preflop because theres lots of hands the opp might have which have you well beaten AK AQ AA etc.

Aggression is good postflop but I'm but without a line on what this guy usually minraises with I'm too afraid of AK AG here to commit much money to the pot. Therefore its cheaper just to fold preflop.

Rondavu

01-23-2006, 05:07 PM

#7 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 3,053

I don't automatically fold this to a raise preflop. That line is blatantly incorrect. Just ask Fnord. No choice should ever be automatic.

It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.

mxiu

01-23-2006, 06:40 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 982

Occasionally I'll call that raise and see how the opp acts on the flop and take it from there though.

Seasider

01-23-2006, 07:09 PM

#9 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Bangor UK

Posts: 563

I think it was played fine with a good read on the villan. I liked the check on the river which suggests you had some idea of what he was after.

Also + 130 one night and -40 the next is still +90! Think long term!

01-23-2006, 07:22 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2006

Posts: 1,095

Just think about the other 70% of the time when he doesnt hit his flush by the river and you take down a descent pot.

Why re-raise PF? JAos is not a great hand. Usually you will either win a little or lose a lot with that hand.

WildBobAA

01-23-2006, 07:24 PM

#11 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: lol i dunno

Posts: 1,811

Yea, dump this preflop

Knytestorme

01-23-2006, 11:18 PM

#12 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2005

Location: Australia

Posts: 562

Thanks for the advice all, here are my thoughts on the hand to answer some of the questions.

I played AJ as we were down to 5 handed on the table and tried playing it with slightly looser starting hands, being on the button made that decision easier too as I am only really behind to 5 other hands and the odds of those being out there 5 handed are not great.

The reraise was mainly because I put the CO raise as a blind steal, which I think his fold to the reraise indicates was a correct read.

With the check on the flop to me, and the A hitting I figured I was ahead and put out a pot size bet to see where I was as well as to not give him odds for the draw. If I'd been reraised here I was ready to let it go due to his cold call of a re-raise before him pre-flop.

After the check on the river I put him on the fluch draw and didn't want to give him a free card or the odds to draw so bet out 3/4 of the pot. Looking now I think that bet may have been too small on a pure pot odds calculation (and that is what I am mainly trying to figure out) but I don't think now that he would have gone away even if I'd dropped the hammer.

With the check on the river to me I had him pegged to check raise me and decided to just check it out and see if I was right on what he was chasing. Figured I was happy with what was in the pot if I was wrong, and didn't want to lose more if I was right.

In terms of my overall game though and comments here, I think AJ play might be a leak in my game and will be the first thing I check when I get poker tracker reinstalled.

Thanks guys.

bdawg56kg

01-24-2006, 08:48 AM

#13 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Oct 2004

Location: Honolulu

Posts: 1,201

I don't know what's with all the fold preflop comments. At a nine or ten handed table, then yes I probably dump this preflop, but this is 5 handed, and I find these silly minraises rarely are hands that dominate AJ. Most of the time it's a low pocket pair or a couple of broadways or a suited connector. So I like the reraise since it's probably enough to isolate with one caller, and you have position. Without position I probably don't reraise. What hands has villian shown down after minraising like that before? Personally I like the line Knytestorme took here. I think it was played well on all streets, except I might bet a little more on the turn like $6. River is a standard check behind IMO.

Jimmy Mac

01-24-2006, 12:43 PM

#14 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: Drinking your milkshake.

Posts: 950

I like it.

So funny that the villian had the stone cold cheek to check his flush to you on the river after chasing it all the way . Well done for checking behind there.

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