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Impending doom?

  
 
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strawman
Old 04-20-2006, 09:02 AM     Post subject: Impending doom? #1 (permalink)  
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I flopped the second nuts and opted to slow play the flop. The action on the turn didn't give me any indication that I might be second best. The only time I felt I was in trouble with this hand was after the all-in reraise on the river. At that point I definately thought my opponent on the Qh but I also couldn't see folding my hand. If he had me beat I guess I'm paying him off.

Any second opinons?

Texas Hold'em $0.25-$0.25 NL (real money), hand #385,616,741
Table Helgoland, 19 Apr 2006 10:57 PM
Seat 1: SjermsF ($17.20 in chips)
Seat 4: EddyMcLittle ($32.95 in chips)
Seat 5: Kid_JW ($20.40 in chips)
Seat 6: phsk7 ($11.85 in chips)
Seat 7: jboice ($25.95 in chips)
Seat 9: tylibrown ($20.55 in chips)
Seat 10: alfil [JH,8H] ($71.55 in chips)

ANTES/BLINDS
EddyMcLittle posts blind ($0.15), Kid_JW posts blind ($0.25).

PRE-FLOP
phsk7 calls $0.25, jboice folds, tylibrown folds, alfil calls $0.25, SjermsF bets $1, EddyMcLittle folds, Kid_JW folds, phsk7 calls $0.75, alfil calls $0.75.

FLOP [board cards KH,4H,AH ]
phsk7 checks, alfil checks, SjermsF bets $1, phsk7 calls $1, alfil calls $1.

TURN [board cards KH,4H,AH,3H ]
phsk7 checks, alfil bets $3, SjermsF calls $3, phsk7 folds.

RIVER [board cards KH,4H,AH,3H,10S ]
alfil bets $5, SjermsF bets $12.20 and is all-in, alfil calls $7.20.
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bdawg56kg
Old 04-20-2006, 10:02 AM #2 (permalink)  
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I know your hand is so pretty, but don't slowplay the flop. Multiway raised pot versus opponents that are probably bad means that you will get paid off, not to mention you don't want to give a free card to the nut flush draw, should someone have the Qh. I would check the turn and check/call the river. What are you trying to accomplish by betting on the turn and river? As played, fold to the river raise. He has the Qh almost always here.
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strawman
Old 04-20-2006, 10:29 AM #3 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdawg56kg
What are you trying to accomplish by betting on the turn and river?
I have a decent grasp of when I am ahead in a hand but I find myself losing the thread when I am letting someone catch up only to find they have passed me. I took a risk on the flop since he'll miss his redraw to a higher possible flush the majority of the time, assuming he has the Qhx and doesnt already have the nut flush. I thought both were unlikely to occur.

I bet the turn to see where I was at expecting a reraise if he hit. The river sequence was a big tell that he had and I suspected I was beat but just couldn't lay it down.
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DaHorror
Old 04-20-2006, 01:18 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Since someone is more likely to put you on one of the high cards on this flop, betting it out is not a bad thing. This guy could have QQ with the Q in hand. He's probably going to stick around anyway, but at least you can more easily give it up on the turn and realise that you are beat.
I highly doubt he's pushing the river without the Q here...the T might call, but it doesn't raise.

I think you did get the information that you were looking for on the turn - he smooth-called you, which means he's probably got the better flush at that point and isn't worried about a redraw.
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sejje
Old 04-20-2006, 03:19 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I don't slowplay these kinds of hands. I don't even slowplay when I flop the nut flush with AKs.

Regardless, if I slowplayed it, I'm not putting a dime into the pot after the turn. You'll win REALLY small pots, and lose every single big one.
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strawman
Old 04-20-2006, 07:43 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHorror
.the T might call, but it doesn't raise.

I think you did get the information that you were looking for on the turn - he smooth-called you, which means he's probably got the better flush at that point and isn't worried about a redraw.
Good points to think about on both streets. I think from this point forward I've learned my lesson about slow playing on coordinated boards since they are sucking up too much of my stack. I'm tired of chipping away at $1-$2 pots and then flopping a succulent hand only to find myself lured by Sirens and watching an hours work go down the drain.
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gabe
Old 04-20-2006, 08:07 PM #7 (permalink)  
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get in the habit of not slowplaying in unraised pots
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strawman
Old 04-21-2006, 07:15 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
get in the habit of not slowplaying in unraised pots
The pot was raised pre flop but that is neither here nor there. I think the more valuable lesson from this, at least from my perspective, was assesing the unlikeliness of an event happening and not the probability of the event occuring. Regardless of how unlikely it was of him having the QH and having another heart hit I did nothing to charge him a price to see his hand through. My calling the bets basically justified his play from a pot odds perspective. Additionally it's not like I have a locked hand here, just the second nuts at the time and for all I know he could be on a redraw to a boat or better on this flop so my tunnel vision as to his hand potential was pretty piss poor on my part as well.
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