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Staple Gun

04-25-2005, 10:48 PM Post subject: Im such a wuss, I'm such a wuss, I'm such a wuss....

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Gamblers Anonymous

Posts: 812

Hand #5587283-1227 at Cali (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 25/Apr/05 18:27:32

THE_VINMAN is at seat 0 with $22.40.
boxinbonanza is at seat 1 with $21.85.
JcTc is at seat 2 with $27.55.
donstaun is at seat 3 with $26.45.
drschlong is at seat 4 with $33.
Joe721 is at seat 5 with $21.15.
kp_holdemhigh is at seat 6 with $28.65.
mopar5540 is at seat 7 with $37.95.
toml_8 is at seat 8 with $17.50.
Doc Trock is at seat 9 with $20.25.
The button is at seat 0.

boxinbonanza posts the small blind of $.10.
JcTc posts the big blind of $.25.

THE_VINMAN: -- --
boxinbonanza: -- --
JcTc: -- --
donstaun: -- --
drschlong: -- --
Joe721: -- --
kp_holdemhigh: -- --
mopar5540: -- --
toml_8: Kc Kd
Doc Trock: -- --

Pre-flop:

donstaun folds. drschlong calls. Joe721 folds.
kp_holdemhigh raises to $.50. mopar5540 folds.
toml_8 re-raises to $1.50. Doc Trock folds.
THE_VINMAN calls. boxinbonanza folds. JcTc folds.
drschlong calls. kp_holdemhigh calls.

Flop (board: Qd 7s 9h):

drschlong checks. kp_holdemhigh checks. toml_8 bets
$3. THE_VINMAN folds. drschlong folds.
kp_holdemhigh raises to $15.35. toml_8 folds
kp_holdemhigh is returned $12.35 (uncalled).

Hand #5587283-1227 Summary:

$.60 is raked from a pot of $12.35.
kp_holdemhigh wins $11.75.

Good laydown or am I just afraid cuz my overpairs have lost a lot for me lately? The guy proceeded to tell me he was bluffing but I dont belive him.

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evman150

04-25-2005, 11:35 PM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Victoria BC

Posts: 269

I'd push. He could easily have AQ or worse.

Light years ahead of the competition.

JeffreyGB

04-25-2005, 11:57 PM

#3 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Dec 2004

Location: Jenks, OK

Posts: 3,477

You folded?!?

I'd push this every day and twice on Sundays. That is, unless you have a read on the player. The minbet on the flop, if unusual, could indicate that he has a great hand (AA) and wants people to stay in. Or it could indicate that he has a moderately good hand and feels like he oughta raise some (AQ/KQ). Or he could be bluffing completely.

I run a training site...

Check out strategy videos at GrinderSchool.com, from $10 / month.

a500lbgorilla

04-26-2005, 12:11 AM

#4 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

Join Date: Sep 2004

Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

gamb0l!

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

Staple Gun

04-26-2005, 02:18 AM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Gamblers Anonymous

Posts: 812

So I guess the consensus is to call. My reasoning behind folding is that i figure theres about 6-7 hands he could have right now.

I lose

AA - Improbable woulda reraised on flop
QQ or 99 - What I figured he had
77 - I've seen a lot of people overplay low pockets preflop at these tables

I win
AQ - Probably why I would have called
KQ - Dont think hes goin all in, probably woulda raised the flop
Bluff... Likely JJ or AK maybe flush draw (had no read on him)

Overall I think he would be more likely to play with the first group of hands, and check the flop. He could be going all-in because he is afraid of the flush draw and has a set or AA. But looking back on it I think the reason I folded was because if I called and lost that would throw away the money I won so far during my session.

Anyways I won about $15 off him about 10 hands later when I flopped a straight vs. his 2 pair.

ender555

04-26-2005, 03:49 AM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 647

re-raise AI...

but what do you mean overplay low pockets?
low pockets rule because when you hit a set you almost always de-stack people unless the board forms an easy flush or strait on the flop.

I think there was already a thread on here, but it's statistically correct to call if the bet preflop is 10% or less of the stack of you or your opponent.

However I'm not completely sure about that figure because, wouldn't tha be assuming that you take their entire stack IF you hit, and everytime?

drmcboy

04-26-2005, 05:25 PM

#7 (permalink)

DrButtInski
Administrator

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 9,602

If he had called your bet would you still have put him on a set?

I think you're playing above where your BR can handle if you're folding here for 12 bucks. You've essentially played your KK like it was 55.

Staple Gun

04-26-2005, 11:22 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Gamblers Anonymous

Posts: 812

Quote:

I was not afraid of the $12, I'm simply try to maximise profits and minimize losses. My bankroll is sround $300 and I have been playing these limits for about a month.

Quote:

but what do you mean overplay low pockets?
low pockets rule because when you hit a set you almost always de-stack people unless the board forms an easy flush or strait on the flop.

I mean by overplay small pockets is they will raise with hands like 7-7 in a ten person game. I also call usually up to 3x bets with low pockets but nothing more unless theres a few people in the pot already.

However I am now thinking the odds I had the better hand were easily over 50% making a call the right move, but I dont think its a rediculous notion to think I was behind.

Lucid

04-27-2005, 02:20 AM

#9 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Nov 2004

Posts: 142

You are such a wuss, you are such a wuss, you are such a wuss

3 reasons why you should have called:

1) Your opponent min raises, which is a sign of erratic and poor play. There is a good chance that he is bluffing or semi-bluffing.

2) Your opponent raised pre-flop but did not reraise after you raised. Since he did not reraise he probably doesn't have AA, and QQ is less likely as well. Alot of players will min raise with semi-strong hands so there is a good chance that he has Kq or something.

3) You have an overpair. Since you have a stronger pair than the highest card showing you beat lots of hands that this guy might have.

Since we are not given any information about this players style I would would wager that you folded the best hand.

Staple Gun

04-27-2005, 10:48 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Gamblers Anonymous

Posts: 812

Lucid your post made the most sense of any yet and truly convinced me I should've called.

Borax

04-29-2005, 01:05 PM

#11 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Feb 2005

Location: Norway

Posts: 584

I would have pushed here.
After his preflop play I would put him on AK/AQ/AJ/JJ/TT/99/KQ and I think he wouldn't raise a set on that flop, so I think he is playing his Q putting you on AK or he is bluffing. Anyway better to push here.

Staple Gun

05-03-2005, 11:13 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Gamblers Anonymous

Posts: 812

I had to post this hand from today since it was very similar. Note that I was behind after the turn with almost the same board.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #5587356-10659 at Shiraz (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 03/May/05 19:05:16

shakecity is at seat 0 with $11.30 (sitting out).
TENZEN is at seat 1 with $64.75.
LosFinest is at seat 2 with $21.10.
teachercoach4 is at seat 3 with $110.90.
mpf8888 is at seat 4 with $41.60.
davemac2005 is at seat 5 with $26.
samboy29 is at seat 6 with $37.85.
Stranny is at seat 7 with $48.05.
st_james is at seat 8 with $24.50.
toml_8 is at seat 9 with $94.15.
The button is at seat 6.

Stranny posts the small blind of $.25.
st_james posts the big blind of $.50.

TENZEN: -- --
LosFinest: -- --
teachercoach4: -- --
mpf8888: -- --
davemac2005: -- --
samboy29: -- --
Stranny: -- --
st_james: -- --
toml_8: Kd Kc

Pre-flop:

toml_8 raises to $1.50. TENZEN calls. LosFinest
folds. teachercoach4 folds. mpf8888 folds.
davemac2005 folds. samboy29 calls. Stranny folds.
st_james calls.

Flop (board: Qc 9h 2d):

st_james bets $.50. toml_8 raises to $2. TENZEN
calls. samboy29 re-raises to $5. st_james folds.
toml_8 re-raises to $15. TENZEN folds. samboy29
calls.

Turn (board: Qc 9h 2d 8h):

toml_8 bets $21.30. samboy29 calls.

River (board: Qc 9h 2d 8h Ks):

toml_8 bets $.50. samboy29 goes all-in for $.05.
toml_8 is returned $.45 (uncalled).

Showdown:

toml_8 shows Kd Kc.
toml_8 has Kd Kc Qc 9h Ks: three kings.
samboy29 shows Qd 9d.
samboy29 has Qd 9d Qc 9h Ks: two pair, queens and nines.

Hand #5587356-10659 Summary:

$3 is raked from a pot of $81.45.
toml_8 wins $78.45 with three kings.
----------------------------------------------------------------

Lucid

05-04-2005, 12:42 AM

#13 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Nov 2004

Posts: 142

This is a different situation for many reasons:

You were the only one that raised preflop. Hands like Q9 are likely to call a small raise but they are not likely to raise.

You had 3 other opponents instead of two, which increases the chances that someone is going to outflop you.

Your stacks are twice as deep.

Your opponent played very reasonably, which indicates that he is a better player and less likely to make a poor bluff.

By the time I got to the turn I would have suspected 99 or Q9. But you still have to go all-in becaue the pot is already over 30 dollars, he only has 22 dollars left, and its better to be the aggressor in this situation that waiting for him to bet or letting him draw.

Why did you only raise to two dollars on the flop? You should have raised to at least 5 dollars with 7 dollars in the pot. Plus you get alot more information from somebody raising a decent sized bet then you do from somebody raising such a small raise from you. If I was reraised to like 10 or 12 dollars after I bet 5 this says something to me. I decide to fold or play on at that point based on knowledge of my opponent.

Also, I think you should have raised at least 4xbb if not more pre-flop. You want to raise more for just the reason you lost. You want to limit the amount of people that might outdraw you or at least raise enough so that it is unprofitable for them to call.

SinkRox

05-04-2005, 12:56 AM

#14 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Brighton, UK

Posts: 624

his badbeat serves him right for playing Q9s esp with that action preflop, he deserved that!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ender555

re-raise AI...
I think there was already a thread on here, but it's statistically correct to call if the bet preflop is 10% or less of the stack of you or your opponent.

However I'm not completely sure about that figure because, wouldn't tha be assuming that you take their entire stack IF you hit, and everytime?

Not neccaserily, but possibly to some degree... i've got two thoughs:

with more than one person in the pot its makes it easier to get your implied odds

if it is HU at flop then sets are disguised, helping ability to extract chips.

any other views ppl?

Element187

05-04-2005, 06:30 AM

#15 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Orlando, FL

Posts: 802

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

You folded?!?

I'd push this every day and twice on Sundays.

only twice on sundays, i do it at least 5 times on sunday to keep that new rain forrest mountain smell at the computer.

"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls

Element187

05-04-2005, 06:31 AM

#16 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Orlando, FL

Posts: 802

seriously, push... over pair isnt a bad hand... no straights or flushes to fear, just sets, might as well check under your bed for monsters.

"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls

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