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i'm lost....

  
 
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cardsman1992
Old 04-14-2006, 02:41 PM     Post subject: i'm lost.... #1 (permalink)  
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against this type of villain. He is 47/11 and 4.05 AF postflop after 188 hands with him. If you wanted to see a flop against him, you were calling a raise or reraise the majority of the time. I think he had air, but I couldn't call his push. What is the best line against this villian? I see a couple of errors, I think. Should have just folded preflop, for one. I don't think I should have raised on the flop either. Would anyone have called this push figuring it was air? I didn't want to try to draw to a gutshot. And I am trying to tone down my calls some thanks to other advice I have read around here. But I knew I could destack him if I ever hit a hand against him. Unfortunately a few hands later, when I had KK, he had left the table.....

PokerRoom No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($9.25)
Button ($39.90)
SB ($31.35)
BB ($42.40)
Hero ($48.50)
UTG+1 ($34.15)
MP1 ($24.90)
MP2 ($27.05)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with T, J.
Hero calls $0.25, 1 fold, MP1 calls $0.25, 2 folds, Button calls $0.25, SB completes, BB raises to $2.25, Hero calls $2, MP1 folds, Button calls $2, SB folds.

Flop: ($7.25) 6, 8, K (3 players)
BB bets $2, Hero bets $9, Button folds, BB bets $40.15 (All-In), Hero folds.

Final Pot: $56.40

Results in white below:
No showdown. BB wins $56.40.
I also think targeting that one particular player to play a hand against is just bad poker too. Thoughts?
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martindcx1e
Old 04-14-2006, 03:02 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Umm ya good fold. He may have air but so do you. You have no pair and no draw so you can't call that push. If you know villain is super aggressive and likes to raise and re-raise alot then don't raise his flop bet with this kind of hand. I would fold pre-flop (especially since BB raises lots pre-flop) but do what you want pre-flop as long as you can stay out of trouble post-flop.
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bair
Old 04-14-2006, 03:11 PM #3 (permalink)  
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definitely fold..you dont even have a gutshot. and targeting a player that you know you can outplay is great poker
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cardsman1992
Old 04-14-2006, 03:19 PM #4 (permalink)  
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I knew I couldn't call it. I was more concerned about the raise on the flop. What I was trying to accomplish was either take the pot there (not too likely), or get him to just call and see a turn and go from there. I figured a J on the turn might even have been good enough against him. I didn't think he would push.

Regarding the targeting, what I meant more was going out of my way to get in a hand with him (leading to calling large raises with a drawing hand like JT), which I feel MAY throw your game off...
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cardsman1992
Old 04-14-2006, 05:15 PM #5 (permalink)  
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One other thing that factored in my raise on the flop was that I had already laid down a couple of times to his bets. I did not want to continue to show weaknes for him to feed off of...that being said, there were much better spots to be had, I am sure.

He had won so many pots without ever having to show cards. He has only gotten to SD 18% of the time I have played with him. I wish he would be forced to show more....
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AHiltz
Old 04-14-2006, 05:16 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I find that calling a flop bet and then raising his turn bet gets more folds. I have to have a read that he's capable of making a laydown for this to work though. I find that Laggs don't like getting pushed off of flops.
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cardsman1992
Old 04-14-2006, 05:26 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AHiltz
I find that calling a flop bet and then raising his turn bet gets more folds. I have to have a read that he's capable of making a laydown for this to work though. I find that Laggs don't like getting pushed off of flops.
I will pick a spot to try that line next time. That seems a little bit like the line where you lead out with air, then fire the second barrel on the turn. A lot of people don't call a turn bet that they would have called on the flop, I guess...

Thanks!
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Renton
Old 04-14-2006, 05:34 PM #8 (permalink)  
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 don't play JTo UTG. The best way to play maniacs like this is by calling with speculative hands in position, hitting the flop really hard, and then letting him bluff all his chips to you.
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cardsman1992
Old 04-14-2006, 05:40 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renton
don't play JTo UTG. The best way to play maniacs like this is by calling with speculative hands in position, hitting the flop really hard, and then letting him bluff all his chips to you.
You don't even limp it early looking for a good draw or two pair?

Due to the possibility of it getting raised up, I am guessing....
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relayer
Old 04-14-2006, 05:58 PM #10 (permalink)  

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I just don't see the reason for the flop bet at all. You have nothing and the read doesn't suggest you can push him off his hand like this.

And I hate JTo UTG, but that's just me...
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Renton
Old 04-14-2006, 07:30 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsman1992
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renton
don't play JTo UTG. The best way to play maniacs like this is by calling with speculative hands in position, hitting the flop really hard, and then letting him bluff all his chips to you.
You don't even limp it early looking for a good draw or two pair?

Due to the possibility of it getting raised up, I am guessing....
Yes the possibility of a raise is a lot of the reason. However, I don't even know if playing JTo out of position in NLHE is +EV for even one bet preflop.
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