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chewbaka
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06-26-2008, 02:39 AM
Post subject: How far will you go to protect your unimproved AA postflop?
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#1 (permalink)
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 106
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Hi I need a thorough discussion about this subject.. Barring reads, how far will you go to protect your unimproved AA postflop. I think this is one of my biggest leaks, stacking off with big pairs againts opponents' sets.
Last night this hand happened (25NL- 9 handed), villain is aggresive, aggresive. Big losses had put him on tilt.
Hero $34 (UTG) with AA limps $.25
all folds
Villain $31 (Button) raises to $1.25
BB calls $1.25
Hero repops to $5.5
Villain calls
Flop is 698 rainbow. I bet $9. Villain calls.
Pot is about $30.
Turn is a blank. I bet the rest of my stack $20 (too aggresive? should I have checked?).
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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limp raise is the gay, im glad he sucked out on you.
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Stacks
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Im opedipus bitch, the original balla.
Posts: 2,608
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Yeah don't limp/raise there. But anyways, it depends on so much that you aren't really going to get a solid answer. It depends on stakes, on player, on board texture, preflop action, among many other things. Right now at 10nl I really don't have too much regret if I stack off with a high overpair on a board unless I was shown for certain I was beat. They just call with TP like it's the nuts.
So it depends is my answer.
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Keilah
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Northern BC, Canada
Posts: 658
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AA + 3bet pot / 100-ish BBs = 99.9% stack off.
Only dont if the flop is KKQ.
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chewbaka
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 106
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by badgers
limp raise is the gay, im glad he sucked out on you.
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Way to open up a discussion with a constructive response. I almost always never limp with AA in any position. This is an isolated case. Villain was wild and was turning the table over.
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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You played it fine but don't limp reraise with AA if you aren't going to do it with other stuff
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BankItDrew
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
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Depends on the size of the pot preflop
Ignore people when they say "don't limp AA utg." There is nothing wrong with doing the opposite from what our opponents would think from time to time. The key is to not limp AA utg at every opportunity. Villain made a mistake in the hand when calling the re-raise, so it worked out great.
This hand is pretty easy to play after the flop action. Villain has about a half pot sized bet left on the turn, so it's a standard push.
I'd like to add to the limp AA utg... that the other key, along with gear changing, is having the discipline postflop to let AA go when there are more players in the pot due to no raises preflop. It's a high risk high reward situation.
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chewbaka
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 106
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Quote:
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I'd like to add to the limp AA utg... that the other key, along with gear changing, is having the discipline postflop to let AA go when there are more players in the pot due to no raises preflop. It's a high risk high reward situation.
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I've done that myself, you got to have the discipline to let it go.
Quote:
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You played it fine but don't limp reraise with AA if you aren't going to do it with other stuff
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Thanks matey. So you won't reraise even if you know that villain will make outrageous raises with anything and that some players who have a read on villain might jump in as well with their own 3-bets?
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Keilah
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Northern BC, Canada
Posts: 658
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He's saying you have to balance your range by limp-reraising, like T9s or 33 or something
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by chewbaka
Quote:
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Originally Posted by badgers
limp raise is the gay, im glad he sucked out on you.
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Way to open up a discussion with a constructive response. I almost always never limp with AA in any position. This is an isolated case. Villain was wild and was turning the table over. |
Sorry I was pretty drunk last night... I'll try and be more constructive now.
In a 3bet pot it's going to take a hell of a board for me to not want to stack off with AA 100BBs deep. I recently had my AA flop a QJT board and I though villains range to call my 3bet was something like 99+/AK which is the sort of super-scare board you need to be worried about.
However, against an aggressive opponent with the sort of dynamic you have described it is almost always correct to stack off and you played it fine (actually I don't hate the lim/reraise if villain is a complete maniac.)
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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Also your title is pretty dumb, you shouldn't be worried about "protecting" AA but maximising value. "Is there value in this shove?" would be a better title and the answer against a loose player is clearly yes.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Deanglow
You played it fine but don't limp reraise with AA if you aren't going to do it with other stuff
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I don't think that there is a need to balance a play if it is a one time thing to exploit a specific player in a specific situation.
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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chewbaka
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 106
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Quote:
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Also your title is pretty dumb, you shouldn't be worried about "protecting" AA but maximising value. "Is there value in this shove?" would be a better title and the answer against a loose player is clearly yes.
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I think its the hand sample more than the title... BTW, oppenent had 88
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Vrax
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Full House
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Poland
Posts: 632
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Why there is so much hatred to limp-re-raising top range? I don't think it's bad on aggressive table...
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"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy
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cowboyardee
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 66
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Vrax
Why there is so much hatred to limp-re-raising top range? I don't think it's bad on aggressive table...
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It's fine really only on a table full largely of super aggro TVpokerjunkiedonks. At a table full of smart aggro players it screams top range and kills your action on further streets unless someone flops a better hand. And against thinking players or tables with a (more realistic) mix of thinking players and donks, there's no way that I know to balance this play out that doesn't just fuck you proper way too often.
Taking OPs word that this was a table full of aggro donks, there's really nothing wrong with the way you played the hand that I can see. Turn bet is +EV against a loose player and you just ran into a cooler given the situation.
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AlexMorris
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 73
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Villian went set-hunting with bad odds. You stack off here and be happy that villian is retarded.
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