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How do you play this river?

  
 
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WildBobAA
Old 02-25-2006, 04:04 AM     Post subject: How do you play this river? #1 (permalink)  
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I'm thinking I should have led the flop and turn, thoughts?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

BB ($264.80)
UTG ($146.90)
UTG+1 ($59.40)
MP1 ($701)
MP2 ($245.60)
CO ($242)
Button ($76)
Hero ($229.60)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J, J.
UTG raises to $6, 1 fold, MP1 calls $6, 3 folds, Hero calls $5, 1 fold.

Flop: ($20) J, 9, 2 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP1 bets $12, Hero calls $12, UTG folds.

Turn: ($44) 3 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets $24, Hero raises to $70, MP1 calls $46.

River: ($184) 8 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets $104, Hero calls $104.

Final Pot: $392
 
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dsaxton
Old 02-25-2006, 05:12 AM #2 (permalink)  
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Check-raise flop, bet river. I don't understand this line of check-calling the flop and checking the turn. If he has overcards, he just checks behind on the turn, if he has an overpair or top pair, he would call or reraise on the flop, which is good if you want money in the pot. Any betting line that doesn't even give the other guy a chance to lose money in these situations makes no sense to me.
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jmontis
Old 02-25-2006, 05:26 AM #3 (permalink)  
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in these situations they either have nothing or the pure nuts. Whichever sounds more logical is read dependant
take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
 
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Pelion
Old 02-25-2006, 10:38 AM #4 (permalink)  
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I dont think he has the straight or flush. He was way too aggressive for a draw. I think it is more likely he hit his set. There are a few possible hands out there for him to hold and theres no way you can fold that river.

He could have AJ but that would be pretty unlucky. I think there are too many hands that lose here for you to fold.

Other than that I would probably raise the flop. Dont want to be giving away free cards on a board like that.
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Fnord
Old 02-25-2006, 11:14 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Agree with dsaxton. This is a great line to win darn near the minimum in the long run.

Quite often it goes something like this:
check, bet, call
check, check
bet (probably either bigger or smaller than normal too), fold
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Amilo
Old 02-25-2006, 11:40 AM #6 (permalink)  

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I say 999 hehe
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IowaSkinsFan
Old 02-25-2006, 04:16 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 I'd raise all in on the river, even though it's only a bit more. I'm almost positive you are winning here. but yeah your flop and turn line sucks.
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Renton
Old 02-25-2006, 05:34 PM #8 (permalink)  
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 He wouldn't have made any money on this hand if he'd have CR'ed the flop. I have found that if you play passively preflop, and then get active all of a sudden on the flop, its a dead giveaway on your hand. If he'd have been the raiser preflop, this would be a different story, he could have been more aggressive postflop, because of a lack of credibility.

I think Bob's line was fine, although since that turn card made a straight AND flush draw apparent, I would have pushed the turn. On the turn he is GUARANTEED to be ahead of any possible holdings Villain has, so its a win/win situation.

You should have pushed the turn here because you obviously saw the two draws out there, and were anticipating going all the way with this hand no matter what the river card was.
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Lukie
Old 02-25-2006, 07:29 PM #9 (permalink)  
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 J9x 2 tone flop and your flop line is c/c?

Either lead or c/r flop, lead turn on both.
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mcatdog
Old 02-26-2006, 07:42 AM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renton
He wouldn't have made any money on this hand if he'd have CR'ed the flop. I have found that if you play passively preflop, and then get active all of a sudden on the flop, its a dead giveaway on your hand.
If everyone always folds when you check-raise them, it sounds like you need to start check-raising people as a bluff more often. For example if you're in the big blind with 79 and the flop is 866, check-raise the shit out of it and represent the 6.

We must be playing in different games, my check raises get paid off a lot so I don't check-raise bluff that much.
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Miffed22001
Old 02-26-2006, 04:55 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcatdog
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renton
He wouldn't have made any money on this hand if he'd have CR'ed the flop. I have found that if you play passively preflop, and then get active all of a sudden on the flop, its a dead giveaway on your hand.
If everyone always folds when you check-raise them, it sounds like you need to start check-raising people as a bluff more often. For example if you're in the big blind with 79 and the flop is 866, check-raise the shit out of it and represent the 6.

We must be playing in different games, my check raises get paid off a lot so I don't check-raise bluff that much.
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stop checkraising with the nuts and start doing it with air.
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