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Getting value from straights...

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Tabloid

12-01-2005, 02:47 PM Post subject: Getting value from straights...

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: Battersea, London, UK - Pokerroom NL ring (25c - $1) and tourneys

Posts: 5

...with flush draws on board. Both these examples are from 100NL on Proom and occurred pretty soon after one another. I can tell you what I did in both cases, but I'd be interested to to see your thoughts without their being coloured with (probably justifiable) criticism of my actual moves:

What would you do?
--

1)
Seat 2: emilio bar ($107.55 in chips)
Seat 5: Arid Tabloid [10C,KS] ($143.50 in chips)
Seat 6: EpFletcher ($128.10 in chips)
Seat 9: JuanLuckyGuy ($156.20 in chips)
ANTES/BLINDS
EpFletcher posts blind ($0.50), JuanLuckyGuy posts blind ($1).

PRE-FLOP
emilio bar folds, Arid Tabloid bets $3, EpFletcher calls $2.50, JuanLuckyGuy folds.

FLOP [board cards 9C,8C,7H ]
EpFletcher bets $4, Arid Tabloid bets $12, EpFletcher calls $8.

TURN [board cards 9C,8C,7H,JS ]
EpFletcher checks, Arid Tabloid ??????

--
2)
Seat 2: emilio bar ($105.55 in chips)
Seat 5: Arid Tabloid [7C,6H] ($168.60 in chips)
Seat 6: EpFletcher ($123.45 in chips)
Seat 8: kingbronco ($18.60 in chips)
Seat 10: burdett76 ($18.55 in chips)

ANTES/BLINDS
EpFletcher posts blind ($0.50), kingbronco posts blind ($1).

PRE-FLOP
burdett76 folds, emilio bar folds, Arid Tabloid calls $1, EpFletcher calls $0.50, kingbronco checks.

FLOP [board cards 4H,5S,3H ]
EpFletcher bets $2, kingbronco calls $2, Arid Tabloid ??????

I await your verdicts!

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r8ed

12-01-2005, 03:13 PM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 1,524

Hand 1: I would bet enough to take away hit odds to hit a flush but (maybe that plus 50%) and hope he calls against his odds. If he misses the river then value bet. If he hits, you are in position to react to his bet. If you don't want risk that then bet high or push. He already showed he wants to put money in. The only thing to worry about is QT.

Hand 2: I vary min-raising or smooth-calling (mostly min-raising). They have odds to call however. If the turn his, then get ready to fold or try to show down cheap. If it misses then make them pay.

EricE

12-01-2005, 04:40 PM

#3 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Posts: 894

#1: the board is not a flush yet but he is likely drawing to it. I pot the turn thinking he is on the flush draw. When I put people on a flush draw I make them pay to draw out on me. ½ pot is fine but I like to force them to put good money in before they suck out on me. Hehe.

#2: Personally, I raise it to $6. If one or both call then lots of money is going into the pot before the river.

On both I slow way down if the flush hits. Likely fold to any ½ or more bet.

Stakes: Playing $0.10/$0.25 NL

PokerPatNEU

12-01-2005, 05:13 PM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 797

Hand 1: Bet 20-24$

Hand 2: Raise to 7$

BankItDrew

12-01-2005, 06:55 PM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: Losing Prop Bets

Posts: 2,789

BankItDrew will become famous soon enough

1) Bet 1/3 of the pot.

2) Bet 2/3 of the pot.

You want them chasing but you don't want to give them cheap cards.

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Tabloid

12-01-2005, 08:26 PM

#6 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: Battersea, London, UK - Pokerroom NL ring (25c - $1) and tourneys

Posts: 5

Well, example one I bet $15, example two $6, so that seems in line with the broad sweep of thinking.

The question really arose because in both cases I got folded to, so I was wondering if there was any way to get more value from the straight, or I my mind is just being greedy and I should be grateful to be able to drop the hammer and get out of there before the flush hits.

I think I must just be being greedy, bizarrely I had the third of the day just now - the villain of the piece called despite not having the odds, but his behaviour throughout did not suggest a flush chaser, so I called his river bet. The money lost there would seem to back up the theory that one should just hit the straights hard when a flush draw could bring the pain.

Now, can anyone explain the terrible call I just made at 100NL with top pair to a set that cost me nearly a buyin and turned a winning session into a losing one? Thought not, I'll go out back and shoot myself.

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