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dev
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03-04-2008, 05:06 PM
Post subject: gap between PFR and VP$IP
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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How close do we want these two stats to be?
Conventional wisdom says the closer, the better, but it has to cap out somewhere, doesn't it?
Has anyone attempted an experiment with raise-or-fold only preflop?
From the march goals thread:
Quote:
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Originally Posted by kingnat
Narrow the gap between PFR and VP$P (around 5% difference currently)
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5%? and that's not close enough? I realize mine are too far apart, too, but should we be so taggy as to only call preflop 4% of the time? 3%?
Is anyone here running 15/13?
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d0zer
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,527
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I run 16/11 at 25NL/50NL with fairly respectable winrates... 4PTBB/100 on average.
I'm curious if any of the "must be 2% gap" types have ever done a winrate analysis comparing the two styles.
Basically the only difference between me and a 13/11 is that I still open limp low PPs from all positions. I kind of question how much that should affect my winrate given that most critical decisions, where the most money is won & lost is postflop, so a little bit of preflop loose passivity shouldn't do TOO much to your winrate if you're solid postflop. Sure I get burned occasionally & waste a BB when there's 3-betting behind or a PFR from a shortie, so maybe the limp is closer to neutral EV than a limp from LP behind other limpers.
Spoon also made the point that the more passive style is more of an exploitable style, which I imagine is a more important point as you go up in the limits and find yourself against smarter opponents, which is maybe why it's the 100NL+ types who are running 2% gaps & us microstakers are running larger gaps.
Or maybe it's because the 100NL+ types are true sharks, and we're still sharks on training wheels 
I know when I run into a 15/4 I certainly play differently than vs a 15/12. It's far easier to get away from a raise made by a 15/4 than it is a 15/12, so anyone running a HUD (and correctly interpreting stats) will be able to exploit the more transparent style of play that the large gap suggests.
...then again, the HUD multi-tabling regs are usually nitty & hard to extract from at microstakes, so maybe it doesn't matter THAT much...
In conclusion: I don't f'n know 
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XTR1000
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2006
Location: surfing in a room
Posts: 2,188
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I´m 15/13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
xtr stand for exotic tranny retards
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yo
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ChrisTheFish
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Huddersfield, England
Posts: 492
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I run about 30/25 @ 6max.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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I think it depends so much on your tables that you can't narrow it down to what is best generally. having said that, having too wide a gap would make you a more passive player, and that generally makes for a harder game in my experience. If you can pull off the more passive pf game with superior postflop skills, then more power to you.
overall I run in the 20/13 neighbourhood (it is trending towards tigher/more aggressive lately), but this is because I only play 4-5 tables and table select for the loosest ones available (which generally aren't that loose) and therefore have weaker opps.
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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dev
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by XTR1000
I´m 15/13
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and?
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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I'm between 14/12 and 18/16 depending on who is to my left.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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you guys really raise more hands than i think.
200 nL: 14.5/10.2
100NL: 13.6/10
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