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Fold my Full House

  
 
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bspahn
Old 12-29-2004, 01:21 AM     Post subject: Fold my Full House #1 (permalink)  
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bspahn
what could or should I have done differently on this monster hand (for the stakes)
-- it frustrated me to no end and Ill never know what the person had..
----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #3701903-12301 at Syracuse (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 28/Dec/04 21:00:52

shiZZa is at seat 0 with $14.94.
Texacostar_01 is at seat 1 with $3.60.
Hokie93 is at seat 2 with $2.75.
azvpman is at seat 3 with $9.60.
ya-never-no is at seat 4 with $5.45.
bad knight is at seat 5 with $3.40.
frog70 is at seat 6 with $12.41.
suzie79 is at seat 7 with $12.80.
ace69 is at seat 8 with $17.62.
Mystery Trips is at seat 9 with $14.60.
The button is at seat 7.

ace69 posts the small blind of $.05.
Mystery Trips rejects big blind.
shiZZa posts the big blind of $.10.

shiZZa: -- --
Texacostar_01: -- --
Hokie93: -- --
azvpman: -- --
ya-never-no: -- --
bad knight: -- --
frog70: -- --
suzie79: 2c 2s
ace69: -- --

Pre-flop:

Texacostar_01 calls. Hokie93 folds. azvpman folds.
ya-never-no calls. bad knight folds. frog70 calls.
suzie79 calls. ace69 calls. shiZZa checks.

Flop (board: 2h 9h 9d):

ace69 bets $.10. shiZZa raises to $.20.
Texacostar_01 calls. ya-never-no folds. frog70
folds. suzie79 re-raises to $.60. ace69 calls.
shiZZa folds. Texacostar_01 calls.

Turn (board: 2h 9h 9d 6s):

ace69 checks. Texacostar_01 checks. suzie79 bets
$1. ace69 calls. Texacostar_01 calls.

River (board: 2h 9h 9d 6s Jc):

ace69 checks. Texacostar_01 checks. suzie79 bets
$1. ace69 raises to $11. Texacostar_01 folds.
suzie79 folds. ace69 is returned $10 (uncalled).



Hand #3701903-12301 Summary:

$.35 is raked from a pot of $7.60.
ace69 wins $7.25.
----------------------------------------------------------------
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jokerindapack
Old 12-29-2004, 02:12 AM #2 (permalink)  
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There are only 2 hands that beat you 9-2 and 9-9.

GO ALL-IN. If he had one of those to hands oh well rebuy.

In a tournament setting even on the bubble there is no way in hell I would fold.

And remember scared money is lost money.
"You can't lose what you don't put into the middle, but you can't win much either." - Rounders
 
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a500lbgorilla
Old 12-29-2004, 06:41 AM #3 (permalink)  
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Please post your reads.

96, 66, JJ, J9 are all hands that beat him. The only problem is that a lot of fish will play 9x the same way. I don't hate the fold. The huge over bet was unlikely to only be trips. Again, some reads would help.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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Yeldud
Old 12-29-2004, 12:25 PM #4 (permalink)  
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I can imagine that this must have been a tough lay down. Did you have any reads on the player, i.e. super tight and will only play the nuts or wild maniac that will call anything?

I probably would have called, given that there are only 4 hands that beat you - no shame in losing with a full house.

Curious, what in the end made you fold?

As to the frustration, forget it and move on, only dwell on the hand that is being played.
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Muley05
Old 12-29-2004, 02:03 PM #5 (permalink)  

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Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Please post your reads.

96, 66, JJ, J9 are all hands that beat him. The only problem is that a lot of fish will play 9x the same way. I don't hate the fold. The huge over bet was unlikely to only be trips. Again, some reads would help.

-'rilla
If I am looking at this right, 92 would also beat him. Still only five possible hands beat you. it would be tough to fold, but you may have done the right thing.
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a500lbgorilla
Old 12-29-2004, 02:42 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muley05
Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Please post your reads.

96, 66, JJ, J9 are all hands that beat him. The only problem is that a lot of fish will play 9x the same way. I don't hate the fold. The huge over bet was unlikely to only be trips. Again, some reads would help.

-'rilla
If I am looking at this right, 92 would also beat him. Still only five possible hands beat you. it would be tough to fold, but you may have done the right thing.
Those were hands on top of the two the Jokerindapack had listed (92, 99)

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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a500lbgorilla
Old 12-29-2004, 02:45 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeldud
I probably would have called, given that there are only 4 hands that beat you - no shame in losing with a full house.
I still think that a fold was better than a call. More often than not a huge overbet isn't a bluff. So you're only beating 9x (which might not want to put so much in the pot unless they're complete fish) and lose to the other listed hands.

But, again, we need a read.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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Corey
Old 12-29-2004, 02:50 PM #8 (permalink)  
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glad you put that rilla when you put 92 and 99 beat him lol

cuz i was about to


Corey
 
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a500lbgorilla
Old 12-29-2004, 02:58 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Nothin but ball-busters, all of y'all!

No respect.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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bspahn
Old 12-29-2004, 03:21 PM     Post subject: read #10 (permalink)  
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bspahn
hey!! thanks for all the good feedback.
i had only been playing less than half an hour and the person seemed to be a good player being up at almost twice the buy-in at this table. I think from how the person was playing they might very well have had something like 9 and J as the set made them bet the dollar and Jack bet huge at the end, but really I'll never know.

another interesting laydown that I may or may not have done correctly (not a huge hand though) follows:
--------
Hand #3701916-12006 at Southington (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 29/Dec/04 03:00:10

htownmurder is at seat 0 with $8.
Ton-Loc is at seat 1 with $9.85.
Esoqq is at seat 2 with $6.80.
mightymizz is at seat 3 with $4.95.
suzie79 is at seat 5 with $10.20.
iGot5onIt is at seat 6 with $9.80.
CASHISCLAY is at seat 7 with $7.83.
donnykim is at seat 8 with $8.15.
jtdoe is at seat 9 with $7.85.
The button is at seat 2.

mightymizz posts the small blind of $.05.
suzie79 posts the big blind of $.10.

htownmurder: -- --
Ton-Loc: -- --
Esoqq: -- --
mightymizz: -- --
suzie79: Kc Ah
iGot5onIt: -- --
CASHISCLAY: -- --
donnykim: -- --
jtdoe: -- --

Pre-flop:

iGot5onIt folds. CASHISCLAY folds. donnykim calls.
jtdoe folds. htownmurder raises to $.25. Ton-Loc
calls. Esoqq calls. mightymizz folds. suzie79
re-raises to $.50. donnykim folds. htownmurder
re-raises to $.75. Ton-Loc calls. Esoqq calls.
suzie79 calls.

Flop (board: Ac Jc 5h):

suzie79 checks. htownmurder bets $1. Ton-Loc folds.
Esoqq folds. suzie79 calls.

Turn (board: Ac Jc 5h 6c):

suzie79 checks. htownmurder bets $2. suzie79 folds.
htownmurder is returned $2 (uncalled).



Hand #3701916-12006 Summary:

$.25 is raked from a pot of $5.15.
htownmurder wins $4.90.
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twosevoff
Old 12-29-2004, 03:45 PM #11 (permalink)  
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At micro stakes, that would be an auto call for me. With a paired board like that, I might lean towards folding trips with a poor kicker or maybe even a hand as strong as a straight or flush (on a diff. board with possible completed draws) to the overbet at the end. Pot was $17.40 and you had to call $10 more, so if you would have the best hand more than half of the time (which I think you would at this limit), then you're getting more than adequate pot odds for a +EV call.
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Old 12-29-2004, 03:45 PM #12 (permalink)  
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Hmmm on that AK hand you have to raise the flop, and raise the turn to see if he really does have the flush.
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a500lbgorilla
Old 12-29-2004, 03:49 PM #13 (permalink)  
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On the second hand, raise the flop to find out where you are.

It's hard to put him on AA, JJ or AJ with the 25 cent preraise and the 25 cent over the top.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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twosevoff
Old 12-29-2004, 03:58 PM #14 (permalink)  
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twosevoff
Yeah, on the second hand I would raise the flop to find out where I'm at. If he reraises me, I'll have to consider the very real possibility that he has AJ or JJ, and if I have to call a lot in relation to the pot, I'd fold. If he just calls, I put him on AQ, KK, QQ, a flush draw with something like KcQc , or maybe even worse if he could be a wiseguy/very bad or loose player like a lot people are at these limits. If he checks on the turn, I check behind, 'cause I don't want to have to fold a hand that may be good if he decides to make a move on me, but I don't want to pay off his two-pair/set/flush either.

Given that you just called the flop bet, I don't think you should fold the turn. I would raise his bet 3 or 4 dollars to put him to the test, with the intention of folding to a reraise, then check behind or call a relatively small bet on the river (4 dollars or less, more if I have some sort of read to indicate my hand is likely good). Because the pot is so big now, pot odds complicate things, which is why I want to raise to find out where I'm at on the flop, when the pot is small enough that I can still get away from the hand easily).
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jokerindapack
Old 12-29-2004, 05:41 PM #15 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Please post your reads.

96, 66, JJ, J9 are all hands that beat him. The only problem is that a lot of fish will play 9x the same way. I don't hate the fold. The huge over bet was unlikely to only be trips. Again, some reads would help.

-'rilla
I didn't even see that (I blame lack of sleep ).

I wouldn't put him on JJ cause most likely a fish would raise it up pre-flop.

I still stand by what I said though in a cash game. Tournment I'd still make the call but I've change my mind a bit as far as the fold. I'm not going to kill someone in a tournament setting for making that fold. I would say raise harder on the flop and turn though to see where your at.


On the second hand Raise harder pre-flop, re-raise harder on the flop and if he calls and you still wanna fold because you're read is solid that he hit the flush then fold...it's only TPTK anyway.
"You can't lose what you don't put into the middle, but you can't win much either." - Rounders
 
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Muley05
Old 12-29-2004, 05:41 PM #16 (permalink)  

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I don't think I would have folded the second hand on 4th street. It was only two dollars. I would have called, because if another club hits you have the nut flush. Also, either of the two other aces or the three other kings would help you get either a set or two high pair (although I would be very leery of the other guy having a flush). If nothing that helped you came on the river, and the other guy bet, I would fold then. With there being an unpaired board, a club gives you the nuts, and I would call $2 to see if I could hit it.

However, I am also fairly new to poker, so I would be interested to see what some of the other more experienced players thought.
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twosevoff
Old 12-29-2004, 08:18 PM #17 (permalink)  
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twosevoff
Oh yeah, I didn't even notice you had the Kc for the nut draw on the second hand. You folded for a $2 bet in a pot with $5.50 it, which is a bad, overly tight play. I would be willing to call that with just TPTK OR the nut draw. The only flush he could reasonably have with his PF raise and then reraise is QcTc, and even then you're not close to drawing dead and are liable to win a big pot off him if the fourth club hits. He on the other hand could be drawing dead to a single out if he has KK or QQ with or without the Qc. Even if he has AJ, JJ, or AA, you're not in terrible shape as you're drawing at 8 clean outs.
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