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flush vs flush what to do?

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bspahn

03-15-2005, 06:38 PM Post subject: flush vs flush what to do?

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

i heard someone once say losing flush to a flush is like set to a set, what do you guys usually do in this case where you think you might be up against it... did i play this horribly wrong ? you keep saying have more guts have more guts, put your balls on the table... well...

by the end i figure only two diamonds can beat me, i have to take my chances!

----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #4843666-5095 at Agadez (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 15/Mar/05 14:33:08

OChang is at seat 0 with $35.
dogberry7 is at seat 1 with $33.10.
x777x is at seat 2 with $16.85.
vansinne is at seat 3 with $45.15.
Ripcord is at seat 4 with $27.05.
geegee19 is at seat 5 with $17.25.
Utnapishtim is at seat 6 with $33.25.
mikebowers69 is at seat 7 with $16.40.
efilnikuf3 is at seat 8 with $48.85.
suzie79 is at seat 9 with $23.75.
The button is at seat 3.

Ripcord posts the small blind of $.25.
geegee19 posts the big blind of $.50.

OChang: -- --
dogberry7: -- --
x777x: -- --
vansinne: -- --
Ripcord: -- --
geegee19: -- --
Utnapishtim: -- --
mikebowers69: -- --
efilnikuf3: -- --
suzie79: Td 8d

Pre-flop:

Utnapishtim folds. mikebowers69 calls. efilnikuf3
folds. suzie79 calls. OChang calls. dogberry7
folds. x777x folds. vansinne calls. Ripcord
calls. geegee19 checks.

Flop (board: 7d Ad Jc):

Ripcord checks. geegee19 checks. mikebowers69
checks. suzie79 bets $.50. OChang calls. vansinne
folds. Ripcord calls. geegee19 folds.
mikebowers69 folds.

Turn (board: 7d Ad Jc 6d):

Ripcord checks. suzie79 bets $4.50. OChang folds.
Ripcord raises to $9. suzie79 calls.

River (board: 7d Ad Jc 6d Kd):

Ripcord goes all-in for $17.05. suzie79 goes all-in
for $13.75. Ripcord is returned $3.30 (uncalled).

Showdown:

Ripcord shows Qd 9d.
Ripcord has Qd 9d 7d Ad Kd: flush, ace high.
suzie79 shows Td 8d.
suzie79 has Td 8d 7d Ad Kd: flush, ace/king high.

Hand #4843666-5095 Summary:

$2.50 is raked from a pot of $50.
Ripcord wins $47.50 with flush, ace high.
----------------------------------------------------------------

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ilikeaces86

03-15-2005, 06:46 PM

#2 (permalink)

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Join Date: Nov 2004

Posts: 2,141

I am an idiot

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 06:48 PM

#3 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

Join Date: Sep 2004

Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilikeaces86

You should lose your whole stack there every time.

The board is 4 diamonds.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

bspahn

03-15-2005, 06:55 PM

#4 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

so in that case do i have to assume opp has J or Q of d which is the only hand that beats me ?

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 06:56 PM

#5 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

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Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by bspahn

so in that case do i have to assume opp has J or Q of d which is the only hand that beats me ?

Did you have reason to believe he'd bluff you there?

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

bspahn

03-15-2005, 06:57 PM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

i just didnt know, what factors would you take into account - the fact he reraised on the turn ? would you have let this go on the riv but called the turn?

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 06:59 PM

#7 (permalink)

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Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by bspahn

i just didnt know, what factors would you take into account - the fact he reraised on the turn ? would you have let this go on the riv but called the turn?

With his aggression from the third diamond on and your choice to take it to the river, I think you should find a fold here without a read telling you he'll bluff.

Or, you could have pumped it up on the turn but he's most-likely only raising you there when he has you beat.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

bspahn

03-15-2005, 07:08 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

so my river play was bad other than that its okay.

in general though what advice would you have for potential flush vs flush situations ?

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 07:10 PM

#9 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

Join Date: Sep 2004

Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by bspahn

so my river play was bad other than that its okay.

in general though what advice would you have for potential flush vs flush situations ?

With smaller flushes, I'll always be considerably fearless with them especially if the board loans itself to other strong hands and isn't paired.

But if someone does play back when a flush card hits, I'm looking for a cheaper-than-normal showdown.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

bspahn

03-15-2005, 08:52 PM

#10 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

i agree. i'm thinking perhaps it would have been better betting maybe 1/2 or 2/3 pot on the turn and see what happens, maybe call a min raise to the river and check/fold then ?

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 09:49 PM

#11 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

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Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by bspahn

i agree. i'm thinking perhaps it would have been better betting maybe 1/2 or 2/3 pot on the turn and see what happens, maybe call a min raise to the river and check/fold then ?

Well, the turn bet was good becuase you thought you were betting with the best hand. It's when you got min-raised that the bells start going off.

I think a better line would take it down to showdown cheaply incase some Fishy McGoo makes two pair that he thinks is good. Again, it's a lot more playing the player here.

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

bspahn

03-15-2005, 10:13 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Dec 2004

Posts: 851

so really there's not much you can do in this case. you dont want to bet less than the pot because someone with two pair or a set could hit a boat cheaply right.

JeffreyGB

03-15-2005, 10:26 PM

#13 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2004

Location: Jenks, OK

Posts: 3,477

The only possible mistake was the river call. Absent a read, I'd probably call. If I'd played with this player for quite a while and not seen him bluff, I'd fold.

- Jeffrey

I run a training site...

Check out strategy videos at GrinderSchool.com, from $10 / month.

a500lbgorilla

03-15-2005, 10:52 PM

#14 (permalink)

JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD

Join Date: Sep 2004

Location: This room is a good place to be

Posts: 8,379

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

The only possible mistake was the river call. Absent a read, I'd probably call. If I'd played with this player for quite a while and not seen him bluff, I'd fold.

- Jeffrey

You'd call an AI with the 3rd best diamond on a 4 flush board absent a read becuase?

-'rilla

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.

JeffreyGB

03-16-2005, 12:12 AM

#15 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2004

Location: Jenks, OK

Posts: 3,477

Quote:

Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

The only possible mistake was the river call. Absent a read, I'd probably call. If I'd played with this player for quite a while and not seen him bluff, I'd fold.

- Jeffrey

You'd call an AI with the 3rd best diamond on a 4 flush board absent a read becuase?

-'rilla

Hrm. Good point. Because I like making mistakes maybe? I guess I haven't completely worked the "screw you! I have a good hand so you must be bluffing" leak out of my system.

- Jeffrey

I run a training site...

Check out strategy videos at GrinderSchool.com, from $10 / month.

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