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flopping flush

  
 
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Funky
Old 04-10-2005, 09:19 PM     Post subject: flopping flush #1 (permalink)  

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***** Hand History for Game*****
$50 NL Hold'em - Sunday, April 10, (Real Money)
Seat 1 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 1: playcard10 ( $59.26 )
Seat 3: jhable ( $23.72 )
Seat 6: gwendoc ( $25.5 )
Seat 8: wwd05 ( $73.55 )
Seat 10: gadget44 ( $38.97 )
Seat 5: ME ( $30.15 )
jhable posts small blind [$0.25].
ME posts big blind [$0.5].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to ME [ Qd 5d ]
gwendoc folds.
wwd05 calls [$0.5].
gadget44 calls [$0.5].
playcard10 folds.
jhable calls [$0.25].
ME checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ Ad, 7d, Td ]
jhable checks.
ME bets [$3].
wwd05 calls [$3].
gadget44 folds.
jhable folds.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 3h ]
ME bets [$7].
wwd05 folds.
ME does not show cards.


I'm wondering what is usually the most profitable and safe way to play these kinds of hands
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JeffreyGB
Old 04-10-2005, 09:52 PM #2 (permalink)  
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While you don't have the nut flush, you're pretty close. I'd feel confident slowing down a bit here and letting him catch a card/try to bluff you out. If you portray weakness (make the same bet as on the flop, or even check), he may well bet into you. You don't need to protect your hand, so let him hang himself a bit.
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DoGGz
Old 04-11-2005, 01:54 AM #3 (permalink)  
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I'd check the flop if you are first to act, bet if you are last. The last to act normally steals/bets his pair, so it won't look much like you flopping the flush.
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dsaxton
Old 04-11-2005, 02:47 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Check-raise on the flop and bet the turn, check the flop and bet the turn if no one bets the flop, or check-call the flop and check-raise the turn. You have some freedom as to how you play these types of hands, I think. Personally, I would probably check-call the flop, then check-raise the turn, but I think it is probably a good idea to tailor how you play this type of situation based on player and table dynamics (pretend to be chasing against an aggressive bluffer, or something like that).
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Fortune 500
Old 04-11-2005, 04:29 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I agree with slowplaying this. It's a strong, strong hand. There's really only one card that worries you...

However, if the board pairs or another diamond hits, as always, proceed with caution.

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dalecooper
Old 04-11-2005, 08:16 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I like the flop bet. You got called too - good for you. Few people would bet out when they flopped a flush. On the turn I'd probably check and see if I could get him to bet at me, thinking the steal was available. Then I'd raise the same amount he bet and proceed from there.

In short I like how you handled it at first, but automatically escalating the bet on the turn gave him an easy fold. Maybe more money to be made by slowing down.
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danhole12
Old 04-11-2005, 08:41 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsaxton
Check-raise on the flop and bet the turn, check the flop and bet the turn if no one bets the flop, or check-call the flop and check-raise the turn. You have some freedom as to how you play these types of hands, I think. Personally, I would probably check-call the flop, then check-raise the turn, but I think it is probably a good idea to tailor how you play this type of situation based on player and table dynamics (pretend to be chasing against an aggressive bluffer, or something like that).
What makes you think a check-raise would be possible in situations such as these? His opponent didn't seem to like his hand enough to bet it.
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dsaxton
Old 04-12-2005, 12:05 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danhole12
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsaxton
Check-raise on the flop and bet the turn, check the flop and bet the turn if no one bets the flop, or check-call the flop and check-raise the turn. You have some freedom as to how you play these types of hands, I think. Personally, I would probably check-call the flop, then check-raise the turn, but I think it is probably a good idea to tailor how you play this type of situation based on player and table dynamics (pretend to be chasing against an aggressive bluffer, or something like that).
What makes you think a check-raise would be possible in situations such as these? His opponent didn't seem to like his hand enough to bet it.
Eh, because people often bet on flops. He asked what you do when you flop a flush. Even when you flop a flush, someone often still bets. That's what makes me think you can check-raise.
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ensign_lee
Old 04-12-2005, 12:06 AM #9 (permalink)  
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I tend to bet like I have top pair and am afraid of the flush happening. Going forward, but not full speed ahead...

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dsaxton
Old 04-12-2005, 12:24 AM #10 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by ensign_lee
I tend to bet like I have top pair and am afraid of the flush happening. Going forward, but not full speed ahead...
I don't know if that maximizes your profit.
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JeffreyGB
Old 04-12-2005, 12:34 AM #11 (permalink)  
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dsax, if you check raise on the flop, what do you do on the turn? They're not going to raise again if you check to them. Raise then? I'd be curious how the profit from this compares to betting the flop and then checking (intending to check-raise) the turn, as if you were bluffing and are now scared of what he may have called with.
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dsaxton
Old 04-12-2005, 01:05 AM #12 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffreyGB
dsax, if you check raise on the flop, what do you do on the turn? They're not going to raise again if you check to them. Raise then? I'd be curious how the profit from this compares to betting the flop and then checking (intending to check-raise) the turn, as if you were bluffing and are now scared of what he may have called with.
If you check-raised the flop, then bet on the turn. No one else is going to bet for you if you check-raised the flop unless they have a flush or better, so checking doesn't really make sense. Besides, if they called a check-raise on the flop, they're usually going to call a properly-sized bet on the turn as well.

I don't know how the profit compares. It's probably pretty involving figuring out exactly which line of play is the most effective. I think it depends on your opponents, whatever psychological dynamics exist at the table, etc.
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ensign_lee
Old 04-12-2005, 04:50 AM #13 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsaxton
Quote:
Originally Posted by ensign_lee
I tend to bet like I have top pair and am afraid of the flush happening. Going forward, but not full speed ahead...
I don't know if that maximizes your profit.
I think it would. If you're playing with people that pay attention to your bets, then they'll either try to play back at you representing the flush that YOU have, or else they'll call and keep trying to hit that flush, which you're not giving them odds to do.

And when they can pretend, so that they can scare the crap out of you, well, that's when things get maximized.

You have to have aggresive opponents who try to sniff out weakness for this to work, though.

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