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Outlaw
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06-21-2010, 05:16 AM
Post subject: Easy fold or snap call?
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Villain is 38/2/2.0 over 42 hands. GI am having trouble finding a range here.. is this always QQ, KK, Ax, 10x only? Or should I add a bluff in there somewhere? Am I over thinking this or is a fold actually okay?
I was actually thrilled to see the river ace and then he shoves and I'm like.. why can't I be on my starting 50BB stack lol
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
saw flop | saw showdown
CO ($24.25)
Button ($10.85)
SB ($9.95)
BB ($9.25)
UTG ($31.40)
Hero (UTG+1) ($31.45)
MP1 ($19.25)
MP2 ($10)
MP3 ($9.25)
Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with Q , Q
UTG calls $0.50, Hero bets $2.20, 7 folds, UTG calls $1.70
Flop: ($5.15) A , 5 , 10 (2 players)
UTG bets $1.50, Hero calls $1.50
Turn: ($8.15) A (2 players)
UTG bets $2, Hero calls $2
River: ($12.15) A (2 players)
UTG bets $25.70 (All-In), Hero folds
Total pot: $12.15 | Rake: $0.55
Results:
UTG didn't show
Outcome: UTG won $11.60
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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I'm v hungover and this hand might put me over the top on puking. Call river...
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FlyingSaucy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Watching the kids
Posts: 1,603
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I agree on call river. Looks like standard overbet bluff in an obvious bluffing opportunity.
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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You'd have to be insane to bluff here with a missed flush draw.. my line looks just like 88+.. if not JJ+. Why would a 10 shove here? What is he getting value from? 88? 99? Maybe I give him too much credit. This is the type of spot I want to slam my head into the wall.
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ZwiFT
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Valuebet/fold
Posts: 778
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dont see why u cant fold here
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FlyingSaucy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Watching the kids
Posts: 1,603
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The only thing we're afraid of is KK and quad As. Is limp/call KK pre standard for him? What about the weak leads on flop/turn? Seems like a dumbass line to take with both KK and Ax.
Turn the hand around and put yourself in villians shoes. First off you'll find that you are a dumb ass limp/calling nearly 40% of your hands. How many of that 40% hit this flop? There's a lot of 10's in his range that play a flop exactly like that. Bet mid pairs small. I guarantee he's just playing his hand and not gunning for folding out big pairs with a big river bluff. By the time the river hits he's convinced you don't have the 4th A and is like "my T means boat omg push." Most of the time you're folding the best hand against this player.
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingSaucy
The only thing we're afraid of is KK and quad As. Is limp/call KK pre standard for him? What about the weak leads on flop/turn? Seems like a dumbass line to take with both KK and Ax.
Turn the hand around and put yourself in villians shoes. First off you'll find that you are a dumb ass limp/calling nearly 40% of your hands. How many of that 40% hit this flop? There's a lot of 10's in his range that play a flop exactly like that. Bet mid pairs small. I guarantee he's just playing his hand and not gunning for folding out big pairs with a big river bluff. By the time the river hits he's convinced you don't have the 4th A and is like "my T means boat omg push." Most of the time you're folding the best hand against this player.
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You're probably right and at these stakes I really don't have much business folding in these spots. I guess I was gun shy.. I have run into quads like 5 times in the past 2 days lol
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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thread title tilts me. It is close = meh do whatever.
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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His range is so ridiculously wide on flop and turn when riv trips up we can't just eliminate like 99% of hands
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bikes
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a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,463
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jfc i didnt even notice we didnt have 100bbs
wtf call
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ljove
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 80
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Raise flop.He plays everything.
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surviva316
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Confusing people with my liberal biblicisms
Posts: 1,625
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flop and turn look exactly like Tx/5x and a lot of draws/air.
then he way overshoves the river, and it still looks exactly like that.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BooG690
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Imthenewfish
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: sites im allowed to play on
Posts: 947
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ljove
Raise flop.He plays everything.
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wat.
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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lolsnap
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Carroters
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Da Amberlamps
Posts: 2,216
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Really don't hate a fold here that much, think it's really close. In my expereicne of these morons, this line can easily be Ax, it's like they think they have to "slowplay" their hand until the river then make a rediculous value shove into a pot they've failed to build. I think we can pretty much elimate bluffs almost entirely from his range. If he ever does this with Tx then it's obviously a call but I think he's just so much more likely to overbet shove the absolute nuts and continue to gay value bet a hand like Tx given his flop line.
I think we can eliminate a ton of all the random shit that gets to this river this way when he overshoves and give him a fuck load of Ax combos and maybe some Tx and that's about it. There's actually a ton of combos of Ax still in this retard's range given how he plays pre and not as much random shit as people are saying imo.
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steoha12
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High Card
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3
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I dont get why u call the earlier bets with the aces on the board but fold on the river. If i was playing the hand i would have folded on the flop depending on the player and the read or if i didnt place him on the ace you gotta call all the way based on the board. I doubt he was holding pocket kings with a limp it seems to me that he had either a middle pair and limped not knowing how to act in early position and afraid of the reraise or possibly a marginal hand like kq or kj or suited connectors. To me it looks like a straight bluff but then again an low to middle ace 7 could also be a starting hand so u never know it could of been a hell of a fold
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steoha12
I dont get why u call the earlier bets with the aces on the board but fold on the river.
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Because I am beating a lot of his weaksauce donking range...
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ljove
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 80
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You should raise him on flop and try to make he fold
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WildBobAA
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: lol i dunno
Posts: 1,811
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wtf is this table? Do 5 people really have 20 BBs?
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Its a 20-50bb table
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBobAA
wtf is this table? Do 5 people really have 20 BBs?
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stay on FTP imo...
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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Micro2Macro
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: http://three-pair.com/
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if this is a 50bb table your iso sizing is WAYYYY too big
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kidsoldja
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Two Pair
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 34
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id reraise the flop I think.
His betting is very odd but I've seen people semi-slowplay nut hands like this before. Still I think I would put him on a smaller pair and call his all-in.
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Outlaw
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,033
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
if this is a 50bb table your iso sizing is WAYYYY too big
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Raised higher due to the fish factor.
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kidsoldja
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Two Pair
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 34
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I think your hand is easier to play if you raise flop to 4-5$ and then check it down
You can play that way, butt hen you face probably every times river bet and at that case it is overbet and you can´t call, since although his range is Ax or nothing you´re not getting great odds and have to be right close to 50% that he is bluffing
Don´t think he would take that line with KK or Tx too often
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grindinginnj
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Grinding In New Jersey!!
Posts: 143
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I think it is an easy call, if he limped with AA,KK he is gonna win some money the only hand your really afraid of is a weak A of some kind.
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Stackin chips and rippin lips!!
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Imthenewfish
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: sites im allowed to play on
Posts: 947
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ljove
You should raise him on flop and try to make he fold
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why do you want us to fold worse
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