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Dude_Here
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04-22-2008, 08:33 PM
Post subject: 10NL pocket 9's
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 95
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No read. Player was quiet - I've played 10 hands with him in total. I was only thinking of set of 10's, or 2 overcard FD. I was betting my hand for protection / info but then I get this big decision
Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (9 handed) Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
UTG ($9.80)
Hero ($9.20)
MP1 ($9.90)
MP2 ($6.30)
MP3 ($5.55)
CO ($9.70)
Button ($1.85)
SB ($1.50)
BB ($9.65)
Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9 , 9 .
1 fold, Hero calls $0.10, MP1 calls $0.10, 1 fold, MP3 raises to $0.4, 4 folds, Hero calls $0.30, MP1 folds.
Flop: ($1.05) 6 , 8, T (2 players)
Hero bets $1.05, MP3 raises to $5.15 (All-In), Hero ?????
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
You want to hear what you want to hear, and nobody will change your mind.
The lesson which will stay is that which you experience on your own.
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Muzzard
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cheshire, UK
Posts: 1,843
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This is a fold, but I'd c-bet this flop less. I'd say $0.75 does the same job.
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JinxT4
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 265
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Not sure why you only put him on strictly TTT or overs + fd. When you say you were betting for info, what do you think his push tells you. Imo, at worst he has AKdd, but more likely JJ+. Therefore, I'd fold to the push.
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Dude_Here
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 95
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JinxT4
Not sure why you only put him on strictly TTT or overs + fd. When you say you were betting for info, what do you think his push tells you. Imo, at worst he has AKdd, but more likely JJ+. Therefore, I'd fold to the push.
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I meant to include higher pockets in the overcard list. I guess I posted this more to be berated b/c it felt wrong after I did it. I just have to get to the point where I don't do it then feel bad. and just fold instead.
Thanks
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
You want to hear what you want to hear, and nobody will change your mind.
The lesson which will stay is that which you experience on your own.
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JinxT4
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 265
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dude_Here
I meant to include higher pockets in the overcard list. I guess I posted this more to be berated b/c it felt wrong after I did it. I just have to get to the point where I don't do it then feel bad. and just fold instead.
Thanks
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Everyone makes mistakes. Just gotta make sure we learn from em. 
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Dude_Here
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 95
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JinxT4
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dude_Here
I meant to include higher pockets in the overcard list. I guess I posted this more to be berated b/c it felt wrong after I did it. I just have to get to the point where I don't do it then feel bad. and just fold instead.
Thanks
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Everyone makes mistakes. Just gotta make sure we learn from em. |
Just to complete this story, I called after about 5 seconds, equal part mistake and curiosity and villain flipped A,10 off with no diamond and held up. Worst hand in the session for me. Thanks again for the info.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
You want to hear what you want to hear, and nobody will change your mind.
The lesson which will stay is that which you experience on your own.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Muzzard
This is a fold, but I'd c-bet this flop less. I'd say $0.75 does the same job.
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I disagree, Muzz. I'm calling, as played. I like my extra 3 outs, and imo at 10nl this is a common line with FD's or OESD's. I hold some of the outs for both the draws, so I'm blocking and have a decent combo hand.
But limp/call pre with 99? at 10nl? pfr please.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Just saw op's description of how hand ended. Typical. You had more than 8 outs with draws and redraws, so calling isn't terrible.
I would prefer to see hero play this hand aggressively. Think about the action here if hero raises pre. How easy is the decision? How much does he make/lose compared to this line?
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martindcx1e
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
I would prefer to see hero play this hand aggressively. Think about the action here if hero raises pre. How easy is the decision? How much does he make/lose compared to this line?
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it's probably played exactly the same. hero raises to .40 pre-flop, gets the 1 caller, cbets the flop, and dude shoves.
also, this is a really easy fold. to OP, if you put him on a set or overcards with a flush draw then why would you think about calling? you are behind either hand.
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Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
I would prefer to see hero play this hand aggressively. Think about the action here if hero raises pre. How easy is the decision? How much does he make/lose compared to this line?
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it's probably played exactly the same. hero raises to .40 pre-flop, gets the 1 caller, cbets the flop, and dude shoves. |
I disagree, but even if your line is correct, the decision to fold THEN is really easy. At 10nl, I'm not convinced this is autofold the way op played it.
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martindcx1e
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
Quote:
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Originally Posted by martindcx1e
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
I would prefer to see hero play this hand aggressively. Think about the action here if hero raises pre. How easy is the decision? How much does he make/lose compared to this line?
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it's probably played exactly the same. hero raises to .40 pre-flop, gets the 1 caller, cbets the flop, and dude shoves. |
I disagree, but even if your line is correct, the decision to fold THEN is really easy. At 10nl, I'm not convinced this is autofold the way op played it. |
what's the difference? why does not raising preflop make it an easier call? and how does the hand play differently if hero raises preflop? the flop action will be exactly the same either way, and the amount of money made/lost is equal.
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Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
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Dude_Here
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 95
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I believed I was live on any the 4 7's and the 9. I thought it was def possible that I could win the hand unimproved. In fact a,10 was not one of the hands I thought Vill would be raising with but this is 10NL. Mainy though, I don't like my bet/call. There are less risky places to try and get it all in. Next time I would have a smaller bet amt and fold. As for the no raise PF, I've been limping 99 and 1010 in the first 3-4 positions. Postflop play for me can still be too much trouble and so far thats working. I'm moving from 20/8/1 stats to more like 15/7.5/1.5 (only 1000 hands in that DB but looking more like the game I want to play for now). I'm still working on the aggression factor. I'm going to put a post in strategies so I guess any comments for that can go in there.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
You want to hear what you want to hear, and nobody will change your mind.
The lesson which will stay is that which you experience on your own.
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martindcx1e
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dude_Here
I believed I was live on any the 4 7's and the 9. I thought it was def possible that I could win the hand unimproved. In fact a,10 was not one of the hands I thought Vill would be raising with but this is 10NL. Mainy though, I don't like my bet/call. There are less risky places to try and get it all in. Next time I would have a smaller bet amt and fold. As for the no raise PF, I've been limping 99 and 1010 in the first 3-4 positions. Postflop play for me can still be too much trouble and so far thats working. I'm moving from 20/8/1 stats to more like 15/7.5/1.5 (only 1000 hands in that DB but looking more like the game I want to play for now). I'm still working on the aggression factor. I'm going to put a post in strategies so I guess any comments for that can go in there.
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You don't "work" on your aggression factor by deciding not to raise TT in EP. You should be raising at least like 3/4-ish of the hands you decide to play preflop.
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Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
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Dude_Here
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 95
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So would you suggest tightening up a little more and limping less. I'm basically limping 1010 and under from earlier pos's and SC's from mid to late after other limpers. I was previously playing quite a bit looser and also playing above my bankroll req's. I found myself having many 1-2 down BI sessions back to back to back ($10 and $25). After dumping $50 at a 50nl table (yes, classic make it back syndrome) I'm sticking to only 10NL until I can pull my game back into line. So far my last 5 sessions (1 hour/ 4 table) has put me +$50. I also am trying to clear the FT initial bonus so I would love to head back to at least 25 NL for speed purposes but I'm not willing to head there until my game has hit a steady pace that I can be comfortable with and my bankroll is more capable.
Any suggestions on the above info - much appreciated.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
You want to hear what you want to hear, and nobody will change your mind.
The lesson which will stay is that which you experience on your own.
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MuddyWicket
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK, Brighton
Posts: 368
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The thing about raising that 99 is that his AT suddenly looks very weak because of the amount of Aces you could be raising nearly all of which dominate his hand. If an ace flops and you cbet he is playing badly to stay in the pot for too much money.
btw nearly no one shoves a set here at this level. they would call or min raise it, why shove the winning hand?
try to never limp as first in, 90% of the time raise.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by MuddyWicket
try to never limp as first in, 90% of the time raise.
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+1 if 90% = 100%
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