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10k FR hands down now I gots me some questions

  
 
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bigspenda73
Old 11-08-2007, 09:34 PM     Post subject: 10k FR hands down now I gots me some questions #1 (permalink)  
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 I've just completed my first 10k hands at Full Ring this past week. I've got a few questions that I'd like cleared up or at least generate some discussion with.

1. What hand range are you isolating EP limpers with? Is it a button range or are we much tighter when isolating. I.E. UTG+1 limps, we have 87s in MP, insta-raise? limp behind? Assyme we have a TAGG image.

What about K9s, JT0, A6s?

2. The c/c flop, lead turn line I see a lot of. I've only been in a couple spots where I've looked this line up, is it typically:
A. A hand with medium-strength showdown value
B. A strong slow-played hand

3. Are you comfortable getting all of your money in on the flop on just naked FD's. Typically it seems when I b/3bet a flop with either a set/draw I'm constantly being looked up. I guess this means players aren't bluff-raising the flop much. Do you ever expect a player to fold a big overpair to the b/3bet AI line, if not, do you just reserve this line for your sets against the unaware multi-tabling nits?

4. You have KK in a raised pot, flop comes 852 two-toned, you cbet 5/6th pot. Turn comes a blank, you bet 2/3rd pot and get c/minraised by a regular. Insta-fold?

5. Now, the toughest one of them all. 4 way limped pot, with J9s in the SB you flop either:

A. Top-Pair, no kicker
B. Flush draw
C. Straight draw

What is your typical line on these flops? I've been leading the TP hands and folding to a raise. I've been c/c the straight draws and I've been leading the stronger flush draws and c/c the lower FD's.

Thanks and peace out
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Fnord
Old 11-08-2007, 10:24 PM #2 (permalink)  
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1. Who limped? I raise here a lot unless I've shifted into nit gear.

2. Always a fun one. Still gathering data here too. Mixed feeling playing back at these.

My buy-in size usually solves problems 3 & 4.

5. I mix up leads and checks, but tend to bet my draws and tend to check for information with showdownable hands. Although it really depends on how nitty the table is (more inclined to just bet anything) and how frisky the button is (more inclined to c/r his auto-bet.)
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bbqsquirrel
Old 11-08-2007, 10:26 PM #3 (permalink)  
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1) Don't discount limpers just because they didn't raise. I've seen people limp in EP with big pairs or hands as strong as AK / AQs. Plus you don't want to get reraised or cold-call behind by monsters I will fold those speculative hands unless limper is bad and/or table is passive, and then I might limp along.

2) I often find ccall flop-lead turn is usually not a strong line. Raise turn.

3) Passive nits often just flat your lead with one pair (even AA unimproved) even on a drawy board. If you're raised you are most often against a set and so adjust your pot equity accordingly. And no I am not comfortable going AI on flop with a naked FD.

4) Regulars only play OOP with good hands for example pocket pairs/AJs+/KQs. It's much more likely they have a set than some kind of draws. Easy check behind on turn. OOP you're in a much tougher spot.

5) TPnK from the blinds I usually check flop and lead out a benign turn/give up on a scary turn. Draws I like to lead flop, sometimes 3-bet them.
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Clar17y
Old 11-08-2007, 10:41 PM     Post subject: Re: 10k FR hands down now I gots me some questions #4 (permalink)  
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1. 87s in MP isn't exactly an awesome hand, normally i would just limp behind. If there are a few limpers and you're on the button then yeah maybe a raise. Depends on preference. Limp some raise some to balance it out :P

K9s = muck... MP with K9s and you're thinking of isolating a guy from UTG? Maybe on the button if you're feeling brave...
I also don't like A6-A9s, only A2s-A5s, ATs+ so i would prob muck A6s too. JTo same as 87s i guess, limp some raise some.

2. Question = ?
After reading you writing this i've just realised that i only really do it with a draw that hit or a set. Hmm gotta change that. But yeah i wouldn't normally look it up with less than 2pair or TP and a draw...

3. Not unless it was a OESFD, then of course you're 50% against like any hand. Or maybe AKs on an all under board if you know the guy will felt TP. I'd prefer to hit it, but that's because i play with muppets who look you up with any pair. I guess OOP i'd b/c, in position facing a donk bet i'd call or else bet obviously.

4. Hell no insta-fold, this could be 99-QQ/draw enough to be profitable . Not saying insta-pumpfist-shove but i'm not letting go for just a min-raise. If you think it's a set that much just check/call river.

5. TPNK - bet/fold
Flush - bet/call
Straight - b/call

However both of the flush/straights depend on odds if you get uber raised you obviously have to fold. b/3b SFDs call a shove? I find it's better to lead out with a draw because some of the time you take it down, and some of the time you'll hit it with a padded pot. If it gets too heated you can just look at odds/implied odds and fold if neccessary (of course this is +variance).

My £0.02 and this may be bad advice if you're playing like 200NL+ lol,
Clar
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wufwugy
Old 11-09-2007, 03:00 AM #5 (permalink)  
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 I'm hardly comfortable flop felting nut flush draws. If you're called your ace outs are ususaly no good. Always felt oesdfd and pairfd, sometimes i think gutshotfd and bigovercardsfd. Pretty much never felt naked fd.

All forms of good combo draws (ace high draw and better) are hard to fold
 
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EricE
Old 11-09-2007, 08:36 PM #6 (permalink)  
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2) From the previous responses it looks like it varies. I find I do it with medium strength hands. TP no/medium kicker. The check on the flop was to evaluate (OOP) how others liked their hand.
3) Never.
4) I fold unless this regular has been out of line.
5) A I check flop, Bet turn
5) B C/C with odds
5) B C/C with odds
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Da GOAT
Old 11-09-2007, 09:03 PM #7 (permalink)  
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FR key is attack limpers IMO.

not a all UTG limps are uber strong and its cheap to adjust to if they are
Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
 
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