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pokerfan
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05-07-2009, 09:11 PM
Post subject: 100NL, Is this way tooo aggressive ??
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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villain is 18/15/2 over 80 hands. I dont know how often you guys call with 99 on this monotone flop(folding seems too weak). I just figure that my line might be too aggressive vs this passive player who might not stack off with his worse hands and probably only call with better stuff .
No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
UTG ($109.55)
UTG+1 ($100)
MP1 ($100)
MP2 ($100)
CO ($109.20)
Hero (Button) ($107.95)
SB ($181.75)
BB ($100)
Preflop: Hero is Button with 9 , 9
3 folds, MP2 bets $3.75, 1 fold, Hero calls $3.75, 2 folds
Flop: ($9) K, 3, 5 (2 players)
MP2 bets $6, Hero calls $6
Turn: ($21) 9 (2 players)
MP2 bets $15, Hero raises $39, MP2 calls $24
River: ($99) 7 (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero bets $59.20 (All-In),
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daven
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: soaking up ethanol, moving on up
Posts: 5,813
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i check river behind, for the reasons you stated.
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Parasurama
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: DMT
Posts: 820
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Raising the turn was bad
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Parasurama
Raising the turn was bad
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why ? You dont think that these guys'd call with AdK, AdAx, K2s, K3s, 35s,33 or 55? There are lots of worse hands in his range which he bet for value and would call a raise with on the turn. If he is really bad, he might call with AxAx,KxQd,KxJd, KQo,KJo, JdJX or QdQx given his relatively unknown stats. who knows?
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Parasurama
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: DMT
Posts: 820
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I just think it's too strong of a line to take against such a tight player
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pokerfan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Parasurama
Raising the turn was bad
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why ? You dont think that these guys'd call with AdK, AdAx, K2s, K3s, 35s,33 or 55? There are lots of worse hands in his range which he bet for value and would call a raise with on the turn. If he is really bad, he might call with AxAx,KxQd,KxJd, KQo,KJo, JdJX or QdQx given his relatively unknown stats. who knows? |
I think he can fold a pair hand without a diamond which is why it's bad
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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*meh* he already put a fair chunk into the pot. How much more is he putting in with stuff like Kx no diamond vs the value you get from his one pair hands with a diamond by raising the turn to protect your hand and build a bigger pot.
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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I agree with Fnord. This hand is pretty standard and well played.
Calling the flop is standard, he's cbetting nearly 100% of his range here except maybe QQ-TT with a diamond. The turn raise is required IMO. You think villain is folding AdKx or AdAx here? I doubt it considering he's 4-1 to hit and is getting 3-1 on the draw. Same thing goes for 33 and 55, both of which are in his range.
The river shove is fine too, as our opponent should be getting it in on the turn with KK and all non-nut flushes (and even some nut ones.
Looking at combinations, our opponent rarely has KK on this river so the hands that we lose to include: AdQd, AdJd, AdTd, QdJd, QdTd, JdTd and maybe 8d7d. Of these, only the nut flushes I can considerably put in his range for slow playing to the river. So 3 combos we lose to and 6 that we beat from the sets make this river a standard shove.
And if he flopped the nuts and we lose with 2nd set then its just a cooler and move on, there is probably a lot more money to be made looking at closer decisions than this spot.
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mxiu
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 982
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hand was played fine, you lose out on soooo much value if you check behind
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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Anyone have any thoughts on raising the flop?
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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mxiu
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 982
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by badgers
Anyone have any thoughts on raising the flop?
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raise/fold? what cards do we like besides a 9 if opp wants to continue?
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Sir Pawnalot
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Norway
Posts: 668
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I am with you on this line pokerfan.
By not reraising turn we give up a lot of Equity to any diamond. Checking behind on river is something I would never do because of the implications on my meta game.
Well played.
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A foolish man learns nothing from his mistakes.
A smart man learns only from his own mistakes.
A wise man learns from his own mistakes, and those of the smart man and the fool.
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ATOTHEC101
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Full House
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,248
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Completely fine/standard, dunno what the rest of you are on about.
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"This sure beats Super Mario Bros.!" is my ejaculation catch phrase.
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mxiu
Quote:
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Originally Posted by badgers
Anyone have any thoughts on raising the flop?
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raise/fold? what cards do we like besides a 9 if opp wants to continue? |
yeah I am just thinking aloud here I just thought it might be a line some people would take. I'm looking into opening my flop raising ranges in some spots and I think he has to bet/fold the vast majority of his range here, but I guess we have a hell of a lot of equity w/ the pair and FD that we don't want to lose by raise/folding.
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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Parasurama
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Full House
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: DMT
Posts: 820
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I was sort of being sarcastic, what I meant was don't raise this turn if it's going to make you want to check behind this river when he calls.
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Galiana
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Spain
Posts: 20
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After u hit the nine,THIS is a perfect Raise,what do u want..u cant let him to get his fourth diamond,or ur made hand,would be in dangers..i rly approve this bet. Good luck with your game sir.
In my opinion u played it right.
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ZwiFT
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Valuebet/fold
Posts: 778
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by badgers
Anyone have any thoughts on raising the flop?
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Imagine if you called here with TT, you don't call to setmine.. So you have to call the flop because you have so much equity.. but raising the flop with that much equity is really bad, because your basicly bluffing. The same consept applies with 99 here. So calling is the best option, atleast at 100NL where there is no big levling wars going on, or you don't have to balance too much to when you hit your set.
On the turn i elect to call, to get value on rivers from AA, AK, 33 and 55 on non diamond cards. I think if you raise, most hands that will call you are cards like AdKx, AdAx.. Flush and sets will prolly raise..
Because flush and sets would raise the turn do we really mind a small valuebet on the river? Problem is that were getting huge pot odds to call if he shoves and can/should we get away from it?
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