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100NL: QQ 4bet pot with A on flop

  
 
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jimmy44
Old 01-24-2008, 11:39 AM     Post subject: 100NL: QQ 4bet pot with A on flop #1 (permalink)  
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No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
10 players
Seat 1: SB ($149.30 in chips)
Seat 2: BB ($75.00 in chips)
Seat 3: UTG ($82.80 in chips)
Seat 4: UTG+1 ($170.50 in chips)
Seat 5: Hero [ QH,QS ] ($100.00 in chips)
Seat 6: MP1 ($101.85 in chips)
Seat 7: MP2 ($118.50 in chips)
Seat 8: MP3 ($78.20 in chips)
Seat 9: CO ($69.00 in chips)
Seat 10: BU ($89.85 in chips)
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Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is UTG+2 with Q Q
2 folds, Hero raises to $4, 4 folds, Button raises to $13, SB calls, BB folds, Hero raises to $34, Button folds, SB calls.

Flop: 6 9 A ($82, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

Turn: Q ($82, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero ???

First hand of the table.
I played a bit with BU and I know he can 3bet SCs, medium PP from BU, so my 4bet would get folds, except his big hands. I would dump the hand if someone would 5bet/push. If called my plan was to push a low flop against any of the two players.
SB calls, this for me it's a bad player and I cannot put him on a A. However, betting flop would get called only by an A.
On turn, what do you do? My default play would be push, but check might invite a bet from SB on river ...
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Rondavu
Old 01-24-2008, 12:26 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Two things

One hand beats you, and you should never care about it's possible presence. Also, the pot is too big to be pussy footing around extracting from the weaker part of villains range. In other words you don't bet $10 to get loose calls from JJ here. At this point you just bet your hand. $45 is probably about perfect.
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Muzzard
Old 01-24-2008, 01:30 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rondavu
At this point you just bet your hand. $45 is probably about perfect.
Why would you bet 45? That leaves you with 21 for the river and the pot would be around 172.

Why not just push for 66?? Anyone calling the 45 is calling 66
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d0zer
Old 01-24-2008, 01:44 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 I'm wondering about 4-betting queens...

I find I get burned doing this vs tighter players, like a 15/8/3 type, but will often get a fold from 35/20/3 types. Calls from 50/5/1'ers.

Not a critique of the play here. With no reads I don't know what I'd do OOP (vs button)...4-bet may very well be the way to go.

But yeah, with that turn, get'er in...you're getting looked up by AK/AQ, and given the villain's passive line, I wouldn't put that out of his range.
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bode
Old 01-24-2008, 01:45 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerMuzz
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rondavu
At this point you just bet your hand. $45 is probably about perfect.
Why would you bet 45? That leaves you with 21 for the river and the pot would be around 172.

Why not just push for 66?? Anyone calling the 45 is calling 66
i agree. a shove doesnt look quite as strong either.
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Rondavu
Old 01-24-2008, 07:24 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I didn't realize hero had so little behind. Yes a push is good.
It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
 
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jimmy44
Old 01-25-2008, 03:28 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 Yup, that's what I did. Villain folded and I just wondered if I could have played differently.
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pokerfan
Old 01-25-2008, 04:40 PM #8 (permalink)  
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your preflop/postflop line is perfect IMO. Checking QQ/KK on A high flop is good to extract more money from weaker pair hands but lose less money when behind. Given your read on the button, i'm leaning towards 4 bet(2.5x-3x) preflop and playing heads up pot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy44
Yup, that's what I did. Villain folded and I just wondered if I could have played differently.
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