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pokerfan
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08-04-2008, 09:58 PM
Post subject: 100NL, QQ in 3 bet pot vs a decent regular
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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my opponent is jessyj, a 100/200NL solid regular running 14/12/4.4 over 1000 hands. Can you possibly lay down QQ here vs his UTG1 range? 
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
UTG+1 ($105.95)
MP1 ($100)
MP2 ($66.45)
CO ($20.50)
Button ($177.20)
Hero ($98.50)
BB ($55.50)
UTG ($18.50)
Preflop: Hero is SB with Q , Q .
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $3.5, 4 folds, Hero raises to $14, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $10.50.
Flop: ($29) 7 , 2, 2 (2 players)
Hero bets $20.5, UTG+1 raises to $91.95, Hero ?
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ATOTHEC101
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Full House
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,248
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preety gross spot, guess id probably fold as he has kk,aa alot or hands like ak/aq hearts, which have solid equity against you. I suppose he shows up with 1010/jj occasionally but id still fold, what was his timing like on the shove?
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"This sure beats Super Mario Bros.!" is my ejaculation catch phrase.
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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instant shove over my C-BET. My notes on this guy when playing 200NL games last year: 3 bet a lot IP & wide raise in late position.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by ATOTHEC101
preety gross spot, guess id probably fold as he has kk,aa alot or hands like ak/aq hearts, which have solid equity against you. I suppose he shows up with 1010/jj occasionally but id still fold, what was his timing like on the shove?
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badgers
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
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call preflop unless you can stack off on this flop.... both the hands you posted showed a complete lack of plan.
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3k post - Return of the blog!
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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I think this is usually a call preflop against a 14/12 in UTG+1 unless you think turning QQ into a bluff is more profitable than calling for some reason (which obviously isn't the case).
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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gametight
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 494
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Dont mean to hijack the thread but what about if your OOP and the guys a little less aggro. You guys still just calling pre and playing oop??
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...ts-t74361.html
Hand 2 ldo
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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sometimes i really hate to play QQ oop vs these regulars on stars. Yeah, i flat call with QQ ip very often in these games.
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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i had my game plan preflop for sure  . Here I'm just wondering about how you guys handle this situation in these murky spots vs some decent 14/12/4 regulars who open from early 3 positions.
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Originally Posted by badgers
call preflop unless you can stack off on this flop.... both the hands you posted showed a complete lack of plan.
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gametight
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If he's not particularly aggressive then I don't mind playing it out of position.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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bjsaust
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
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I'm never quite sure if in this case we're being asked to evaluate the play or the plan.
For instance if your plan was to bet any non A,K flop and you're not sure what to do now then its a bad plan.
If your plan was to bet any non A,K flop and fold to a push then you just turned QQ into a bluff.
If you're asking whether to fold QQ on a non A,K flop v's a 14/12 who pushes over your c-bet, then its less a question of whether you fold here, and more a question of whether you should have got here in the first place, i.e., are you really asking what your plan should have been in the first place? In that case you should finish the action at the flop and ask what to do there.
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Just playing to improve.
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redih
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Cumberland, Maryland
Posts: 53
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You go AI and collect your money. If he's a regular and you're a regular, he has notes on you probably. If you have to question whether or not to instacall I would imagine he has some notes on you stating you follow up pf bets with flop bets on air. I would probably think you're bluffing with AK and do the same thing he did and AI you with almost anything. But I am a very lagggy player, also very profitable.
I insta call because that was my plan in the beginning. It's a crap flop; if he was trying to trap you, he would've called & re-raised on the turn. Flop AI only shows KK, JJ, TT or air.
I vote for air. JTs.
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Trust your parachute.
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bjsaust
I'm never quite sure if in this case we're being asked to evaluate the play or the plan.
For instance if your plan was to bet any non A,K flop and you're not sure what to do now then its a bad plan.
If your plan was to bet any non A,K flop and fold to a push then you just turned QQ into a bluff.
If you're asking whether to fold QQ on a non A,K flop v's a 14/12 who pushes over your c-bet, then its less a question of whether you fold here, and more a question of whether you should have got here in the first place, i.e., are you really asking what your plan should have been in the first place? In that case you should finish the action at the flop and ask what to do there.
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my plan is that if i 3 bet with QQ preflop , i'd stack off 100% of the time on any flops like this one. :P Sometimes i have the feeling that you guys might find a fold here vs a decent regular player or uber nits.
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bjsaust
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
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That would be my plan, but then I hang out on the 6-max side of the fence  . I just hate playing QQ for set value  .
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Just playing to improve.
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redih
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Cumberland, Maryland
Posts: 53
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Quote:
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That would be my plan, but then I hang out on the 6-max side of the fence . I just hate playing QQ for set value .
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That sums it up.
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Trust your parachute.
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