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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 03:43 PM     Post subject: Soccer (Football) #1 (permalink)  
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Im gonna try to get into soccer and i need to know what/who to watch, and why the rest of the world likes it so much. Ive never been able to get into it (probably cuz ive had no team to root for) so any tips or advice would be helpfull.

Also is MLS any good??? Toronto has a team and if im going to root for anyone it would most likely be them.

Thanks.
 
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bigred
Old 08-15-2008, 03:46 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 Soccer is awesome. MLS is not but oh well.
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 03:47 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
Soccer is awesome. MLS is not but oh well.
What league/teams do you like bigred???
 
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bigred
Old 08-15-2008, 03:48 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 Arsenal in EPL. MLS is still cool to go to games and what not. TV I'd just rather watch the euros.
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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Alexos
Old 08-15-2008, 03:56 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 champions league is the most "accessible" to watch, its the best teams from Europe competing. I'm not rly sure when it starts this year..
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WillburForce
Old 08-15-2008, 04:01 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 new season starts on Sat in England. Get watching - its the best league in the world.

I would say support my team West Ham - but I'd only do that if you're a sadist and enjoy watching your team play like a bunch of tosspots everyweek.

Please, please don't support Man Utd - this will just make people hate you. Arsenal is prob the best choice. Good football and from London.
Normski
 
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bigred
Old 08-15-2008, 04:03 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexos
champions league is the most "accessible" to watch, its the best teams from Europe competing. I'm not rly sure when it starts this year..
They had a qualifying round this past week. Arsenal won 2-0!
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 04:07 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Thanks guys.

I really dont want to support another shitty team and heres why.
Teams i root for now:
Leafs
Raiders
Bulls
Blue Jays

It would be nice to pick a team that is decent at least since im clearly way to loyal.
 
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bigred
Old 08-15-2008, 04:09 PM #9 (permalink)  
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 Choose Arsenal, we're cool
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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Jack Sawyer
Old 08-15-2008, 04:43 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 PRO EVOLUTION SOCCER 6
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kmind
Old 08-15-2008, 08:07 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
PRO EVOLUTION SOCCER 6
QFTTTT
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 09:51 PM #12 (permalink)  
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OMG watching clips on youtube and that Ronaldo dude from Man U is sick.
 
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bigred
Old 08-15-2008, 10:07 PM #13 (permalink)  
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 rooting for man u is like rooting for the yankees, don't be a fgt
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 10:09 PM #14 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
rooting for man u is like rooting for the yankees, don't be a fgt
They win all the time???
 
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Jack Sawyer
Old 08-15-2008, 10:22 PM #15 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by wesrman
OMG watching clips on youtube and that Ronaldo dude from Man U is sick.

don't call him ronaldo, hes christiano ronaldo.

there's another ronaldo, arguably one of the best strikers in recent times from brazil.

watching the RoRo duo from brazil play was like magic.


and bebeto, another great striker.

and taffarel, the best keeper in recent times.



vintage brazil (like from '92) was really something
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 10:26 PM #16 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
OMG watching clips on youtube and that Ronaldo dude from Man U is sick.

don't call him ronaldo, hes christiano ronaldo.

there's another ronaldo, arguably one of the best strikers in recent times from brazil.
Sorry Jack, im new so cut me some slack please.

So far ive seen clips of christiano ronaldo, and some ronaldinho dude and they're both sick. Who else should i check out in a non gay way???

EDIT: http://www.cristiano-ronaldo.org/ron...-10-video.html
 
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Jack Sawyer
Old 08-15-2008, 10:27 PM #17 (permalink)  
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 teams to watch:

Real Madrid

Barcelona FC

Internazionale di Milan (my favourite)

AC Milan

AS Roma


Chelsea FC

Manchester United

Arsenal FC


Ajax FC
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http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 10:50 PM #18 (permalink)  
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What league are they from Jack???


This dude is sick. I had no idea people make moves like this or i would have been watching before this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-MlJ...eature=related
 
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Jack Sawyer
Old 08-15-2008, 10:53 PM #19 (permalink)  
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 Search for the league names, since those teams are from every big league out there


and if you liked CR, check out Zlatan Ibrahimovic, and Ronaldinho

o and Zidane, definetely Zinedine Zidane
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http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 10:56 PM #20 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
Search for the league names, since those teams are from every big league out there


and if you liked CR, check out Zlatan Ibrahimovic, and Ronaldinho
Ive seen Ronaldinho, hes in the first link i posted. Hes nuts too.
 
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wesrman
Old 08-15-2008, 11:49 PM #21 (permalink)  
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Im leaning towards Man U, but im going to wait and see before i make a firm decision. I kind of like it that everyone will hate me for it and they look fun to watch.

Ive seen some cool vids on youtube of Toronto FC fans and its looks like it would be fun to go to a few of their games, although i dont know if they're good or not. The fans look crazy, which i like. Ill definatly be supporting them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrBbJ...eature=related
 
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Thunder
Old 08-16-2008, 01:22 AM #22 (permalink)  
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Why do so many love it? Because it's the best game, most exciting and full of skill. And different skill.

Points/goals aren't scored every other second like in basketball but the premise is to out think and outscore the opponent. And the beauty is seeing it done, like when a defender breaks rank and steams forward to score a goal, seeing the move no one else can. Franz Beckenbauer in his prime was magnificent at this.

You have your no nonsense midfielders, who tackle and make simple passes. Others reply on breathtaking skill and vision.

Sure, score lines are 2-0, 3-1 and never 23-56 but you only get one point per goal. The score line has no reflection on the quality of the match/nor the number of attacks. There have been intense, action filled 0-0 games as well as dull 4-3 games.

Stay away from the MLS and stick to either the Spanish or the English. I'd recommend the English for it's pace and emphasis on attack. It's not the most watched league by accident. The Italian league is technically & tactically superior but also slower and is hard to stomach or appreciate - even for many purists.

You also need to understand the many nuances of football to fully appreciate it. I am a regular on the sport board at IMDB and every day it seems, the Americans keep generating the same myths and misunderstandings so if you suffer from them, this next bit may help.

1) It's not physical/brutal.
For a start, neither is tennis but it's still enjoyable. However, it is. It really is. The difference is, the body parts involved are wildly different to NFL and rugby. The torso can withstand far much more pressure and so can take a massive hit, full on.

In football (soccer to the philistines) the body parts involved are far smaller and more fragile and so the physical aspect may, at first, appear somewhat tame. The lower legs & ankles are the main target. It may not look tough on camera, but you have one of yoru friends hurtle in at full speed and then launch himself, two footed, at your ankles, whilst he wears studded boots.

The head is the other main body part - and is constantly being cracked by other heads and flying elbows. The game may look like it's no contact but it isn't (despite FIFAs attempts to water it down).


2) It's a game of skill not raw power.
One of the oft repeated myths by those across the pond is that it's all down to physical strength and height and that any NFLer would be great footballers. In actual fact, this isn't the case and the bigger/taller guys usually struggle. And they are often seen as lumbering powerhouses rather than skillful and effective.

The common argument is "get XXX, 6' 8" and 350 pounds in the goal area and no one will stop him." Yeah, but he's got to have the skill to score. To get on target. To use poise as much as power. No amount of size and strength can overcome a terrible first touch, or aid to control a ball, or to develop the vision to see and make passes no one else can.

That's why Marco van Basten (usually rated as the greatest striker of all time) was so stunning to watch - as was Zinedine Zidane - because he was 6' 2" yet had the grace and balance of a ballerina.

Touch and finesse are exalted skills. Which is why some of the most impressive goals and moves may not be the most eye catching. For example, a lob is hard enough to perform but when done when off balance, or with the outside of the foot, it is even more astounding. It will take you a while to appreciate but as you get an understanding of the game and what is seen as "normal" you will begin to complement the extraordinary.

Quick examples (should be in the clips below) would be Beckham's laser guided pass to Ronaldo, cutting out the defence, Zidane digging the ball from out of his feet to find a pass that no one else could see & Berhgkamp's goal against Argentina in the 1998 World Cup.

The Bergkamp goal exemplified a number of these key but oft overlooked skills: control (by killing a speeding ball) agility (to spin on a dime and deftness (to curve the ball with the outside of his foot - placement over power).

Another good example would be Beckham's freekick for Man U against Real Madrid. becks has scored loads of free kicks but that was arguably his best - but this may not be so obvious as it wasn't the fastest or the longest kick. But it was close to the area, he had to get it up, round and down and at a tight angle too. And he still sent it in with the precision of a Smart Bomb. When you've seen many people miss, and get an idea for the physics of a ball in flight, then you begin to appreciate the artistry involved.

I mentioned before about people doing the unexpected and the really skillful players, the once in a generation types, make these moves their hallmark and even though the rest of the players are world class, they still cannot operate on the level of these guys. Such as:

Gheorghe Hagi
Maradona
Johan Cryuff
Dejan Savicevic
Hristo Stoitchkov
Marco van Basten
Roberto Baggio
Paolo Maldini

And all of these guys blow away Cristiano Ronaldo. I won't make a big song and dance about it now but Man U should have taken the money for him because he has very little to his game. Find vids of these true creative genuises and then watch Ronaldo - you'll see the difference. He runs and does step overs. Wow. Big deal. His end product is usually naff, he goes missing in big games (even in the CL Final against Chelsea) and harldy any of his goals have been great. The compilation of Beckham blows him away and even without searing pace, Becks was a far better winger, crosser, shooter,passer and free kick specialist.

And differing types succeed too. Hagi, Maradona, Baggio & Zidane were the most skillful players ever. Van Basten and Alan Shearer less so, but as strikers go, these two were the complete, unstoppable package. Left foot, right foot, heading, power, positioning - you name it, these two were lethal and you'd put your house on them to score.



These clips are of the skilful attackers. Newbies to football find it harder to appreciate defensive skills. Otherwise Paolo Maldini would be in this list.


Zidane
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAk2D...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5xhk...eature=related


Bergkamp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCEXkik6Iuk


Baggio
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u55ka...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXsJC...eature=related



Beckham
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF9Pahclz3Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMlGu...eature=related


Le Tissier
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSsdfe4Z69g


Gazza
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXuXu-jDN1E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nOt6...eature=related


Van Basten
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpJna...eature=related



Shearer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0SLW...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByPF_NOYoRo
 
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WillburForce
Old 08-16-2008, 08:34 AM #23 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
Im leaning towards Man U, but im going to wait and see before i make a firm decision. I kind of like it that everyone will hate me for it and they look fun to watch.
don't do this. Man Utd fans are just glory hunting tossers. Why not choose a slighty less well known team? Give your self some respect.

But if you want to watch good football it's got to be Arsenal. They play the best pasing game in the world.

Also check out Paolo Di Canio - West Ham legend and genius footballer...get past the fisrt bit of him pushing the ref:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkYxz...eature=related
Normski
 
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 12:31 PM #24 (permalink)  
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Thanks guys. Very helpfull, yet confusing..lol. Sorry if im annoying you with my dumb questions.

Ok i watched a season preview show last night and i saw what you mean by Arsenal being exciting to watch, but i still have no clue who to pick.

I need some rules explanaition. Whats up with the off sides??? How many games do they play??? Is there a playoffs??? What are the names of the positions??? Anything else that i need to know???

Is there anywhere online that i can watch games without having to pay???

Thunder said to stay away from the MLS, but im not going to get many games per week. At least i should get a Toronto FC game every week, and thats my only chance to ever go to a game.
 
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Muzzard
Old 08-16-2008, 01:49 PM #25 (permalink)  
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Ok.

Offside, is a complicated rule and sometime even the refs get it wrong... http://www.offside-ref.co.uk/laws/11...-rule/detailed

In the EPL and most other leagues I can think of each team plays each other twice.

There are no play offs for the title in the EPL, you need to be top to win at the end of the season- that is all.

Positions- this is a general 4-4-2 formation

1 x Goalkeeper
2 x Centre back or half backs
2x Full back also can be known as Left and Right backs
2x Centre midfielders
1x Left and Right Midfield
2x Strikers
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bigred
Old 08-16-2008, 02:31 PM #26 (permalink)  
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 Nasri scores for the gunners! 1-0 victory
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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Miffed22001
Old 08-16-2008, 02:37 PM #27 (permalink)  
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 arsenal lol
west ham lol
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 02:38 PM #28 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
arsenal lol
west ham lol
Who do u like Miff???
 
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bigred
Old 08-16-2008, 02:42 PM #29 (permalink)  
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 He loves some shit team, I can't remember who though. Like reading or ....wait, it's Sheffield united
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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Old 08-16-2008, 02:42 PM #30 (permalink)  
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doncaster lol
sheff wed lol
sheff united lol
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Miffed22001
Old 08-16-2008, 02:50 PM #31 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
arsenal lol
west ham lol
Who do u like Miff???
i probably shouldnt have on west ham so much but arsenal are the best team who will never win shit.

We all know its man utd vs chelsea (maybe liverpool if they buy some decent wingers)
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Old 08-16-2008, 02:52 PM #32 (permalink)  
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 we got a solid team, just u wait
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 02:53 PM #33 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
we got a solid team, just u wait
Is Arsenal playing right now??

If so where can i watch it online??

I have a couple games on here:
http://www.mogulus.com/rsport

Im watching Everton vs Blackburn right now. Its the only game i can get on TV here.
 
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bigred
Old 08-16-2008, 02:59 PM #34 (permalink)  
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 played this morning
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 03:04 PM #35 (permalink)  
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played this morning
Ya i just saw the highlights now.
 
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PokerSwede
Old 08-16-2008, 03:20 PM #36 (permalink)  
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Go Spurs! (Tottenham) That's the team for you Wesrman!

Although I gotta say hockey >>>>> soccer/football
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:24 PM #37 (permalink)  
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Although I gotta say hockey >>>>> soccer/football
ldo
 
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Thunder
Old 08-16-2008, 03:32 PM #38 (permalink)  
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Ignore WIlburforce. He's talking pure crap. A typical West Ham fan.

Yes, glory hunters support big teams but that as long as you arent' being a glory hunter then you can support whoever the fuck you want.

Wilbur talks about having respect but what respect can you give someone who insta hates anyone supporting a bigger team? Who has such a hard on for priding himself on not following a big team?

What the fuck does starting out with a good team have to do with respect. WIlbur's a dick. End of. Too many like him too.

It's all BS. And reverse elitist crap.

Support who you want, for the right reasons, and it doesn't matter if they're awesome, elite teams like Man U or piece of shit strugglers like West Ham.

Love football. Hate the dickhead mentality.

He laos talks out of his arse when he says:
Quote:
But if you want to watch good football it's got to be Arsenal. They play the best pasing game in the world.
The guy knows fuck all about football - as evidenced by this statement. Probably an early 20's boy with little experience of football on the world stage.

Aresenal play great football. but it's not in the same league as Barcelona, Real Madrid or AC Milan. They have played the best football in England for a good few years but still doesn't compare to the football Man U played from 94 - 2000.

Too many commentators have short memories and the glory hunters he despises so much jump on bandwagons (like Cristiano Ronaldo, Wayne Rooney) and that includes Arsenal. Ironic eh? He follows the glory hunters that he says lack respect. They all marvel at Wayne Rooney when in reality he hasn't developed in 4 years and isn't in the league of Lionel Messi - despite accolades to the contrary. Nor was Ronaldo's goal against Portsmouth "genius" - despite enthusiastic commentary to the contrary.

If Wilbur had any fucking clue about football, instead of his blinkered view of West Ham, he'd be able to offer real fucking advice.

Put him out of his misery and stomp his face into a fucking jar.
 
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CoccoBill
Old 08-16-2008, 03:36 PM #39 (permalink)  
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 Maybe I'm dumb but I don't get it, why do you need to choose a favorite without knowing anything about the sport let alone the teams? I mean, why not just start watching, enjoy different teams and styles of play, learn the subtleties of the game and eventually figure out which team(s) you like?
"Honesty is for the most part less profitable than dishonesty."
-Plato

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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 03:40 PM #40 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoccoBill
Maybe I'm dumb but I don't get it, why do you need to choose a favorite without knowing anything about the sport let alone the teams? I mean, why not just start watching, enjoy different teams and styles of play, learn the subtleties of the game and eventually figure out which team(s) you like?
Good point. I dont really, and thats what im doing. Im just trying to get everyones opinions to help speed up the process. But, i think its way less exciting to watch sports without having someone to cheer for. If it doesnt matter who wins then why watch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunder
Ignore WIlburforce. He's talking pure crap. A typical West Ham fan.

Support who you want, for the right reasons, and it doesn't matter if they're awesome, elite teams like Man U or piece of shit strugglers like West Ham.

Love football. Hate the dickhead mentality.
LOL thats funny. It really makes no difference to me who wins the championship, i just want to root for an exciting team that will be competitive for years. So obviously im picking one of the top teams cuz this is my only chance to "band wagon". Also i dont think rooting for a team that sucks will help me to enjoy the game, which is the point.
 
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Muzzard
Old 08-16-2008, 03:46 PM #41 (permalink)  
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lawl, thunder is priceless

[x] thunder strikes again
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 04:06 PM #42 (permalink)  
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Watched my first game and it was exciting. Blackburn scored in extra time to win. Everton 2 vs Blackburn 3
 
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Muzzard
Old 08-16-2008, 04:08 PM #43 (permalink)  
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Wheeeeeeeeee Ooijer!
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Ablarrrr
Old 08-16-2008, 04:28 PM #44 (permalink)  

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F**k sake 93rd min!!!

no prizes for guessing my team,
If you want to support a team in the premier league that will win cups the go for Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea.

Man U and In paricular Ronaldo were awsome last year but when at their best Arsenal play the best passing game of any team I have seen.

Thunder must be a Man U fan lol and no one can fault you for going with the prem leagues most successful team.

Watch a few weeks of games and decide who u enjoy watching - if you can decide just pick the kit you like best or summat daft like that
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kevster
Old 08-16-2008, 04:31 PM #45 (permalink)  
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 WTF? A football thread with no hating?

Wesrman, go for a good team whatever you do! I got stuck with South-fucking-hampton. Nevertheless, whoever you choose, you'll be lucky to see anything like this....

feast your eyes
- You're the reason why paradise lost
 
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 04:33 PM #46 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevster
WTF? A football thread with no hating?

Wesrman, go for a good team whatever you do! I got stuck with South-fucking-hampton. Nevertheless, whoever you choose, you'll be lucky to see anything like this....

feast your eyes
Cool clips.

As far as going for a good team, ya thats my plan cus the teams i follow in other sports are pathetic.
 
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Ablarrrr
Old 08-16-2008, 04:42 PM #47 (permalink)  

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Ablarrrr
Matt LT just could score some awsome goals, he should of played at a much better club but was very loyal.
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ATOTHEC101
Old 08-16-2008, 04:45 PM #48 (permalink)  
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lol thunder you are truly awesome. Though i sort of agree with what you said...sort of.
"This sure beats Super Mario Bros.!" is my ejaculation catch phrase.
 
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bigred
Old 08-16-2008, 05:08 PM #49 (permalink)  
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 The reason I became an Arsenal fan (sadly he plays for barcelona now)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooBNhVjcR3M
LOL OPERATIONS
 
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wesrman
Old 08-16-2008, 05:22 PM #50 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
The reason I became an Arsenal fan (sadly he plays for barcelona now)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooBNhVjcR3M
OMG that number 1 goal was awesome.

Heres a link to the Liverpool game for anyone interested.
http://www.justin.tv/widgets/jtv_liv...nnel=iraqgoals
 
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