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Is planetluck / starluck playing a fair game?

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salsa4ever

09-30-2005, 02:04 AM Post subject: Is planetluck / starluck playing a fair game?

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Melbourne

Posts: 1,073

Slightly off topic, but since this issue has become somewhat prominent in this forum and I have received many PMs about it...

What do you guys think? I'll give you the pros and cons:

They cheat?
I have done less well than expected across $350 worth of bonuses
Lots of people here have complained about busting out which is really quite rare with a $200 bankroll making $2 bets (wizardofodds calculateds the probability to be 0.25% or 1 in 400).
They are not affiliated with any reputable watchdog i.e. eCoGRA or CasinoMeister or Wizardofodds
They run on proprietary software nothing reputable like Microgaming, Playtech or Cryptologic Software

They don't?
My evidence is anecdotal. Too small a sample space.
People busting out could be playing poorly.
They are affiliated with PartyPoker and it's a large, now publicly listed, company that would not risk cheating

What do you guys think?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigred

Would you bone your cousins? Salsa would.

Quote:

Originally Posted by salsa4ever

well courtie, since we're both clear, would you accept an invitation for some unprotected sex?

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koolmoe

09-30-2005, 03:31 AM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2004

Location: Drowning in prosperity

Posts: 1,279

I cashed out with a significant win in addition to the bonus, not that that means anything.

Poker is freedom

DaNutsInYoEye

09-30-2005, 04:34 AM

#3 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2004

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 1,921

Again... I just did the StarLuck Bonus a couple days ago placing $2 bets playing black jack. I ended up $36 plus the $100 bonus for a net $136. It's one thing to have an odds chart and it's another thing to strictly adhere to it all the time. After playing hundreds of hands it's easy to start playing too fast or just get lazy which can significantly affect your results. I am going to do the PlanetLuck bonus this weekend and I'll let you know how it goes.

TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?

Jeebus Kliest

09-30-2005, 05:15 AM

#4 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Escondido, CA

Posts: 105

I am one of the unlucky ones, did everything to the charts and slowly leaked away the BR. I was about 8 hands till clearing bonus before i went completely broke. Leary to give planetluck the same go...but I probably will this weekend.

20K06 - 20k profit by end of 2006
Progress at http://www.crunchy-in-milk.com

BoondockSaint

09-30-2005, 06:24 AM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2004

Location: Indiana

Posts: 1,844

No starluck has given me the 2 best blackjack sessions of my entire life. If they are cheating or their is some flaw in the program its because their own stupidity and not because they want to. They have no reason to cheat its publicly traded now and the 4 people who started it and run it are all billionaires - yes thats right - they are already billionaires - so its not like they need our money. The gaming business has only created 12 billionaires and 4 of came from party in the last couple years. Amazing.

AHiltz

09-30-2005, 04:24 PM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Coldbrook, NS

Posts: 1,589

I did them both. One of them (I believe StarLuck) I saw $375 in profit placing $5 bets on Blackjack

Jeebus Kliest

09-30-2005, 04:35 PM

#7 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Escondido, CA

Posts: 105

I am just hoping I at least keep the bonus on planetluck to break even lol

1/4 of the way through and +6 bucks..so this run is doing much better so far...

20K06 - 20k profit by end of 2006
Progress at http://www.crunchy-in-milk.com

DaNutsInYoEye

09-30-2005, 06:18 PM

#8 (permalink)

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Join Date: Apr 2004

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 1,921

Just finished clearing PlanetLuck for a net of $104.50.

TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?

Jeebus Kliest

10-01-2005, 07:15 PM

#9 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Escondido, CA

Posts: 105

planetluck did much better for me.

+170.50 including the bonus 100

so -100 + 170.50 = profit of 70.50, would have liked more but at least i made up for busting at starluck, that just must have not been my day.

20K06 - 20k profit by end of 2006
Progress at http://www.crunchy-in-milk.com

eeeee

10-01-2005, 09:22 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2005

Location: SoCal

Posts: 906

Tossing in AceClub (different owner, same software), plus Pbingo (don't do it) for 8 bonuses valued at ~$650, with an EV of >$600 ...

Did slightly worse than EV ( >$450), but that's variance, and well within standard deviation
Only BJ Java was worth it, other games are stingy (VP, DL BJ, ect.) -- I would have done better if I wasn't limited to VP on a couple bonuses.
If they were cheating, I could think of better ways to cheat than giving me $400 and listing crappy payouts on their VP, and pissy rules on their BJ DL. Why not list great payouts and rules, then tweek the software?

It is tempting to say that players who busted at SL/PL did something wrong. They do not have to do anything wrong to bust out. Playing small amounts on bets REDUCES variance -- it does not eliminate it. Betting large amounts, or Martingaling, or other betting schemes, does not change Expected Value, but creates bigger BR swings, and more stories. My SL/PL stories are boring. Boon's stories are exciting ($5/$10 per hand = more drama.)
The lesson to learned isn't to blame others or even self .... just like in poker, self examine for leaks, check your own game, compare to others that have been successful, move on and try again. Crap happens -- that isn't necessarily cheating by the casino.
Those of us who made good money at casinos are pretty fired up, and we make it sound like you can't lose. You can lose. Hopefully it isn't your first casino adventure when you lose. Anyone can "lose" driving their Volvo to the market and getting hit by a bus. But we shouldn't stop driving cars and sending teens through driver's ed. And we ought to have intelligence enough to understand Volvo isn't at fault for the bus. And after we examine the Volvo driver's driving, sometimes, no one is at fault.

I'm a know-it-all.

No, really.

DaNutsInYoEye

10-01-2005, 09:32 PM

#11 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2004

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 1,921

Quote:

Those of us who made good money at casinos are pretty fired up, and we make it sound like you can't lose. You can lose.

Based on anecdotal evidence, I have noticed that people are busting out more than they statistically should. Of course they all could have been playing perfectly, but I doubt it.

TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?

eeeee

10-01-2005, 09:55 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2005

Location: SoCal

Posts: 906

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaNutsInYoEye

Quote:

Those of us who made good money at casinos are pretty fired up, and we make it sound like you can't lose. You can lose.

Based on anecdotal evidence, I have noticed that people are busting out more than they statistically should. Of course they all could have been playing perfectly, but I doubt it.

I doubt it too.
You will also hear about EVERY bust out by a casino noob. You will Not hear about every success, increasing the seeming number of bust outs.

And, again, betting $1/hand reduces variance. Betting $5 increases it.
But we don't casino plunder for Variance, we casino plunder for EV. So a casino noob who "gets it" should keep on trying.

I'm a know-it-all.

No, really.

Jeebus Kliest

10-01-2005, 10:00 PM

#13 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Escondido, CA

Posts: 105

Unlikely but it can happen. I stuck with lovesalsa's advice and did 2 bucks a hand and did bust out. But while I was extremely apprehensive about trying it again I did, and it seems it was just variance. If there was something I did wrong I don't know what it is, because I did the exact same thing for planetluck and came out on top. I just hope that incredibly bad run there doesn't happen again as I am going to continue.

Starluck= -100
Planetluck= +170.50
CON= +347
------------------------------------

So far I am obviously making money. Around the EV so I can't complain. If you guys have any other casino suggestions other than those in salsa's guide let me know.

20K06 - 20k profit by end of 2006
Progress at http://www.crunchy-in-milk.com

salsa4ever

10-02-2005, 12:48 AM

#14 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Melbourne

Posts: 1,073

i'm glad you stuck with my advice and didn't ramp the bets up. Good on you for sticking at it; not everyone is as lucky as I am to be successful on their first attempt playing the casinos but I'm glad you stuck at it and found it was just variance.

Based on the views of the my extremely learned bretheren here, I quash my doubts about Starluck and Planetluck. As you know I've had great success playing bonuses. I'm now convinced I just had worse luck than usual playing those bonuses. For me, the fact that they are a huge company with no motive to take my $100, and the fact that they list the worst blackjack game I've seen on the internet seems to be decisive of the fact that they probably don't cheat.

I still advocate the DL blackjack - about 0.1% more HA, but it's way faster and you'll rifle through your WR.

Jeebus Kliest

10-03-2005, 04:42 AM

#15 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Escondido, CA

Posts: 105

variance is fun...still sticking with it regardless though...

20K06 - 20k profit by end of 2006
Progress at http://www.crunchy-in-milk.com

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Is planetluck / starluck playing a fair game?

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