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2_Thumbs_Up
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08-21-2008, 10:40 PM
Post subject: Democracy
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Sweden
Posts: 271
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This an attempt at debating a few concepts that very few seem to question.
Why is it today generally accepted that the majority should decide over the minority? Is everything moral as long as it's what the majority wants? If not, where should the line be drawn? People seem to associate democracy as the ultimate form of government, but I look at it as the currently least bad. Isn't democracy just mob rule with a few restraints?
Also, I'd like to hear a definition of democracy (I think it's ill-defined and it's important for the discussion). What concepts and freedoms has to be implemented in order to call a country democratic?
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will641
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: getting my swell on
Posts: 1,610
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im pretty sure we actually live in a republic, not a democracy. the only difference is that i think democracies have the people vote on ideas, and republics have the people vote in elected officials who vote an ideas, and in theory reflect the peoples opinion. someone correct me if im wrong i didnt feel like looking it up.
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Cash Rules Everything Around Me.
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Jack Sawyer
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Henry David Thoreau
The government which governs best, governs not at all.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Winston Churchill
It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government, except all others that have been tried.
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My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
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VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
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Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
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2_Thumbs_Up
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Sweden
Posts: 271
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by will641
im pretty sure we actually live in a republic, not a democracy. the only difference is that i think democracies have the people vote on ideas, and republics have the people vote in elected officials who vote an ideas, and in theory reflect the peoples opinion. someone correct me if im wrong i didnt feel like looking it up.
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There might be some language differences between swedish and english here as well so take this fwiw. I do know for sure that the US constitution never mentions the word democracy, it's a republic. However I think the meaning of the words have changed over time. In Sweden, a republic is a country with a president and a democracy is any of the examples you mentioned.
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Palantine
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 28
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The terms "republic" and "democracy" have become almost interchangable in political science discussion due to the impractibility of direct democracy on a large scale. I think the most technically accurate description of the United States government is a federalist democratic republic.
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bigred
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PROFESSIONAL TROLL
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Nest of Douchebags
Posts: 2,184
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Palantine
The terms "republic" and "democracy" have become almost interchangable in political science discussion due to the impractibility of direct democracy on a large scale. I think the most technically accurate description of the United States government is a federalist democratic republic.
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federalists suck, long live the whigs
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LOL OPERATIONS
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zook
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,676
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Winston Churchill
It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government, except all others that have been tried.
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this
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flomo
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: mashing potatoes
Posts: 878
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pro hemp bro!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
Protect dog
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BennyLaRue
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 646
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Palantine
The terms "republic" and "democracy" have become almost interchangable in political science discussion due to the impractibility of direct democracy on a large scale. I think the most technically accurate description of the United States government is a federalist democratic republic.
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Constitutional Federal Republic FTW.
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Chopper
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 4,255
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heres my thing:
when your "elected officials" make up their own mind, according to their own agenda, independent of their constituents voices, THEN what do we have?
...the United States of America.
neither a republic nor a democracy anymore. just a bunch of red tape, big money, and self-serving pricks.
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LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.
Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!
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Silly String
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: KC, MO
Posts: 1,434
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Still a republic b/c you can vote the "elected officials" out of office. Provided you can get enough informed voters that don't have a self serving agenda.
Corruption brought down most republics that failed so far and will continue to do so in the future, IMO.
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Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.
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frosst
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08-22-2008, 02:23 PM
Post subject: Re: Democracy
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#12 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: count-n mah monies stewie-style
Posts: 220
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by BennyLaRue
Constitutional Federal Republic FTW.
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+1 according to the CIA
https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...elds/2128.html
Quote:
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Originally Posted by 2_Thumbs_Up
This an attempt at debating a few concepts that very few seem to question.
Also, I'd like to hear a definition of democracy (I think it's ill-defined and it's important for the discussion). What concepts and freedoms has to be implemented in order to call a country democratic?
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Democracy is a system of government by which political sovereignty is retained by the people and exercised directly by citizens.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by 2_Thumbs_Up
Why is it today generally accepted that the majority should decide over the minority?
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because if the majority agree on it, then mostly everyone will be happy.....you know since everyone can't get what they want, at least most everyone is getting what they want
Quote:
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Originally Posted by 2_Thumbs_Up
Is everything moral as long as it's what the majority wants? If not, where should the line be drawn?
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no, but that's not the purpose of a democratic government. the purpose is to keep the power of government with the people. the line should be drawn in the sand, or wherever the people want.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by 2_Thumbs_Up
Isn't democracy just mob rule with a few restraints?
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yes, but............Constitutional Republics are a deliberate attempt to diminish the threat of mobocracy thereby protecting dissenting individuals and minority groups from the tyranny of the majority by placing theoretical checks on the power of the majority of the population.[1] The power of the majority of the people is checked by limiting that power to electing representatives who, theoretically, are required to govern within limits of overarching constitutional law rather than the popular vote having legislative power itself (even though such representatives are elected by said majority, creating a definitive conflicted interest). The United States of America is one of the oldest constitutional republics in the world. (from wikipedia  )
but how many wpp did i gain?
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Chopper
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 4,255
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Quote:
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the line should be drawn in the sand, or wherever the people want.
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someone made a funny. wp 
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LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.
Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!
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Jack Sawyer
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
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simple fact: the majority is always stupid.
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My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
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VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
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Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
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Silly String
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: KC, MO
Posts: 1,434
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Why do you think the framers of our constitution understood the need for checks and balances under our constitutional republic so well?
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Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.
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Thunder
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Flush
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: England
Posts: 561
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
simple fact: the majority is always stupid.
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In the words of Metallica "Sad But True".
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frosst
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: count-n mah monies stewie-style
Posts: 220
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Silly String
Why do you think the framers of our constitution understood the need for checks and balances under our constitutional republic so well?
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ummm, a few hundred years of Authoritarianism?
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Silly String
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: KC, MO
Posts: 1,434
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Yeah, those were some self serving bastards.
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Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.
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Chopper
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 4,255
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anyone for tea?
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LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.
Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!
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asdpikas
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,056
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Regarding capitalism and democracy...
Anarchist saying #1
If voting could change things, it would've been forbidden a long time ago
Anarchist saying #2
40 million flies can never be wrong, vote shit!
Anarchist saying #3
If shit was worth money, the poor would be born without an asshole
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"could I take out every woman and child in a border town?"
For the right to be governed, waste them without mercy.
When you've decided. Meet me at the airport.
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