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Why do i INSIST on calling these?!

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Jamjoe

01-29-2008, 01:14 AM Post subject: Why do i INSIST on calling these?!

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Dec 2007

Posts: 68

After doing well at $5NL (up over 5ptbb/100 over 20k+ hands) i moved up to $10NL but for some reason I just keep on calling allins when ive been the aggressor and I keep losing them (clearly)
I really could do with some advice as im running out of profits to play with and will soon be at original BR. Most of these are just terrible play im sure and a prime example of falling in love with hands, pls help

These are the top 5 losing hands over the past 2,000 -

HAND 1:
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (10 handed) Party-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($9.80)
UTG+1 ($2.04)
UTG+2 ($10.44)
Hero ($10.35)
MP2 ($10.85)
MP3 ($1.65)
CO ($1.74)
Button ($4.40)
SB ($9.50)
BB ($11.47)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K

, K

.
2 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.4, Hero raises to $0.7, 3 folds, Button calls $0.70, 2 folds, UTG+2 calls $0.30.

Flop: ($2.25) 5

, J

(3 players)
UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $1, Button calls $1, UTG+2 calls $1.

Turn: ($5.25) T

(3 players)
UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $3, Button calls $4.40 (All-In), UTG+2 calls $10.44 (All-In), Hero calls $10.35 (All-In).

River: ($30.53) 3

(3 players, 3 all-in)

Final Pot: $33.44

HAND 2:
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (10 handed) Party-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

UTG+2 ($10)
Hero ($15.72)
MP2 ($10)
MP3 ($9.50)
CO ($10)
Button ($9.65)
SB ($7.90)
BB ($14.62)
UTG ($2)
UTG+1 ($8.05)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with

.
3 folds, Hero calls $0.10, MP2 raises to $0.5, 1 fold, CO calls $0.50, 3 folds, Hero calls $0.40.

Flop: ($1.65)

(3 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets $1.2, CO raises to $2.7, Hero calls $2.70, MP2 folds.

Turn: ($8.25)

(2 players)
Hero bets $5, CO calls $10 (All-In), Hero calls $1.80.

River: ($21.85)

(2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $25.05

Hand 3:
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (8 handed) Party-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

MP1 ($10.77)
MP2 ($1.85)
CO ($10.90)
Button ($10.53)
SB ($2.30)
Hero ($9.65)
UTG ($2.49)
UTG+1 ($10.51)

Preflop: Hero is BB with

.
4 folds, CO raises to $0.2, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.10.

Flop: ($0.45)

(2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $0.2, Hero raises to $0.4, CO raises to $1, Hero calls $0.60.

Turn: ($2.45)

(2 players)
Hero bets $1.3, CO raises to $2.6, Hero calls $1.30.

River: ($7.65)

(2 players)
Hero checks, CO calls $10.90 (All-In), Hero calls $9.55 (All-In).

Final Pot: $28.1

HA ND 4:
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (10 handed) Party-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

UTG ($18.38)
UTG+1 ($10)
UTG+2 ($1.27)
Hero ($9.90)
MP2 ($2.15)
MP3 ($11.48)
CO ($3.91)
Button ($3.91)
SB ($8.37)
BB ($10.20)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with

.
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.3, 1 fold, MP3 calls $0.30, 4 folds.

Flop: ($0.75)

(2 players)
Hero bets $0.1, MP3 raises to $0.4, Hero raises to $0.7, MP3 raises to $2.1, Hero calls $1.40.

Turn: ($4.95)

(2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 bets $2, Hero calls $2.

River: ($8.95)

(2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 bets $4, Hero calls $4.

Final Pot: $16.95

HAND 5:
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (8 handed) Party-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

MP2 ($10.67)
CO ($4.71)
Button ($10.21)
SB ($10.78)
BB ($3.94)
Hero ($9.65)
UTG+1 ($5.88)
MP1 ($27.79)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with

. Hero posts a blind of $0.10.
UTG+1 calls $0.10, MP1 calls $0.10, MP2 calls $0.10, 2 folds, SB completes, Hero (poster) checks.

Flop: ($0.55)

(6 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.1, UTG+1 raises to $0.4, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, SB folds, Hero calls $0.30.

Turn: ($1.35)

(3 players)
Hero bets $0.6, UTG+1 raises to $1.2, Hero calls $0.60.

River: ($3.75)

(3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets $2, Hero raises to $5.4, UTG+1 calls $5.88 (All-In).

Final Pot: $17.03

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leanne

01-29-2008, 01:25 AM

#2 (permalink)

Join Date: Jan 2008

Posts: 2

hi jamjoe

AlphaKennyBody

01-29-2008, 01:45 AM

#3 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Dec 2007

Posts: 108

Just skimming through, right off the bat I noticed something consistent with your play--your reraises are only minraises. If you're gonna raise, raise like you mean it. Anyways, I'm no expert, but here are my thoughts...

Hand 1: Raise to $1.20-$1.50 preflop. As played, throw in a $2 bet on the flop, and if you still have two callers like that, you're almost always behind here. Check turn, fold to any decent sized bet. Don't feel bad about folding KK here. Most of the time it's saving you money by doing so.

Hand 2: Checking that flop is fine, but please please please reraise once it gets to you. You actually didn't play it too terribly, but it looks like you were destined to go broke here anyway.

Hand 3: Again, if you're gonna raise, raise bigger. After it's 3-bet on the flop you might wanna think about letting this one go (unless villain is a complete donk). Turn just sucks, and I would hate to do it, but fold to the overbet on the river. Smells like a boat.

Hand 4: Raise to $0.40 or $0.50 preflop. Fire off a good-sized c-bet on the flop and reraise him to about $3 after he minraises you...do NOT minbet here and do NOT minraise. As played...sucks if he drew the flush, nh if he had the boat.

Hand 5: Once again, don't minbet that flop. There are potential flush draws as well as straight draws that you don't want to let in cheap. This hand it looks like you were destined to lose to...losing w/ 2nd nuts fucking blows, but hey, it happens.

Just work on sizing your bets bigger. If you're scared of betting so much at this level, move back down to 5NL until you can grind up a roll that you're comfortable playing with.

martindcx1e

01-29-2008, 03:22 AM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 3,614

2,3, and 5 are pretty much unavoidable by the river so don't be so hard on yourself.

Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.

bode

01-29-2008, 03:25 AM

#5 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: May 2006

Location: slow motion

Posts: 4,270

bode is an unknown quantity at this point

i get it in on most of those. all but hand 1.

Quote:

eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.

ApocalypseCow

01-29-2008, 04:07 AM

#6 (permalink)

Join Date: Jan 2008

Posts: 22

I'm sorry, but I have to know:
Did losing hand 5 feel like getting kicked in the balls? I would probably have had to get up for a few minutes. You always remember beats like that.

I know I had someone beat my set of aces with pocket tens making runner-runner 4-of-a-kind about a month ago, and I seriously almost cried. Obviously I'm still not over it either.

thizzSantaCruz

01-29-2008, 07:07 AM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Oct 2006

Location: Santa Cruz

Posts: 894

Send a message via AIM to thizzSantaCruz

what everyone else said. raise more pf, no min raises you are just pricing people in to stack you with pocket pairs and SCs.

Flopping quads and boats like its my job

Jamjoe

01-29-2008, 11:53 AM Post subject: Thanks

#8 (permalink)

Join Date: Dec 2007

Posts: 68

Ok thanks - i dont feel so bad now, it started off with me losing KK to 22 twice within about 10mins on flushless straightless aceless boards :P ill give it another shot - i still have the BR for $10NL and 3buyins of profit still to play with. Will just concentrate and make the loses back - got a $100 bonus coming through in about 2days of playing too so that will help me feel a bit better :P

Jamjoe

01-29-2008, 11:59 AM Post subject: Results

#9 (permalink)

Join Date: Dec 2007

Posts: 68

By the way if you were wondering:
Hand 1: Villian held 1010 making a boat on the turn
Hand 2: Villian held 88 giving him a higher set
Hand 3: Villian held A2 giving him a boat on the river
Hand 4: Villian held JJ giving him a set on the flop
Hand 5: Villian held KJ giving him a higher boat on river

Chopper

01-29-2008, 01:29 PM

#10 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

heres the thing to remember here, jamjoe.

it appears most are agreeing that these were largely unavoidable situations. theres solace in that....take it to heart. we call it variance most times.

but, variance is a major destroyer of a bankroll. if you are having trouble watching your stack dwindle...as most of us do...and you confidence is taking a hit...DROP BACK DOWN for awhile.

go back to 5NL, get your "jamjoe" back. rebuild your roll back to the level at which you move up to 10NL.

i'm sorry...variance is a big killer of a bankroll, but BANKROLL MANAGEMENT IS THE BIGGEST KILLER!!! and, its not even close.

dont get undisciplined because the cards arent running like they used to. use your head, and come back when you still have the roll. there's no shame in moving down levels because of bad swings...even bad play.

but, going busto, imo, is SHAMEFUL.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Rondavu

01-29-2008, 02:02 PM

#11 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 3,053

You have way too much money left on the river a lot. Being afraid you won't get action, literally means you don't get action. Build big pots with big hands. I like nothing more than having a non decision on a scary river, since I'm already committed. Often enough it's your opponent who's committed with the losing hand.

It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.

kingnat

01-29-2008, 02:35 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Posts: 827

kingnat is an unknown quantity at this point

Noobish breakdown:

In Hand 4, we have out of position on the flop, with Js 4c 3s... the pot is $.75 and both opponents started with 100BB.

Against a standard unknown, we Cbet 100% of the time here, yes?...

So we lead PSB ($.75), and opponent reraises 3x ($3 total, $2.25 to call), against an unknown is this a fold/call/shove? (Should we have a percentage for these?). My initial instinct is shove, since this is a draw heavy board... and opponent could make this play with any AJ, KJ, JT hand...

If opponent minbets our PSB, do we call or shove?

If opponent shoves over our PSB do we call or fold?

So you click their picture and then you get their money?

Jamjoe

01-29-2008, 03:09 PM Post subject: Moving down

#13 (permalink)

Join Date: Dec 2007

Posts: 68

I have already moved back down to $5NL now. Going to stay there at least till i clear the $100 bonus then might consider taking another shot at $10NL but ill set a point where ill drop down again, maybe after losing 2/3 Buyins then build the $30 back up at $5NL.

My BR now is about $170 so ill take the shot once i reach $250. At least Ive learnt a few things from my 4k hand shot at $10NL, ive made my preflop raises 4bb+1bb/limper instead of a standard 3bb and now im reraising preflop, atm mainly with AK AA KK hands, what kind of hands should i be reraising with should i include AQs QQ JJ? Im reraising 3times their raise.

bigslikk

01-29-2008, 03:14 PM

#14 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Apr 2006

Location: Chicago

Posts: 445

Quote:

Originally Posted by martindcx1e

2,3, and 5 are pretty much unavoidable by the river so don't be so hard on yourself.

I agree, minus hand three. While it's hard to get away from trip aces / queen kicker on that board... consider the fact that the turn ace didn't put the hero ahead of any hand that was beating him on the flop. After the fact, it's easy to see that the ace was a terrible turn card, but that fact could've been discerned during the hand as well. He three bets the flop(okay, really small, but nonetheless), later goes ape. We're praying for AJ here? Seems a little desperate IMO. The other hands are unavoidable tragedies.

Oh except for hand 1. That was painful. Do you know what the most obvious indicator of Queens / Kings / Aces is? The pre-flop minraise.
Ex: BB = 0.10, someone raises to 0.80, someone minraises to 1.50. It SCREAMS premium pair, because the re-raiser is doing everything in his power to keep his "pigeon" in hand, whereas as the same time, he minraises, hoping for some kind of pre-flop shove fest.

Raise / Re-raise big pairs like a man. This is good more many reasons:

1. You get more value; villains surely call. When you have AK and go ape pre-flop, you still get callers, so why fear losing them with the KK or AA?

2. Eliminate reverse implied odds. When you have a big pair, you're going to have an overpair on most flops. You will likely be getting money in on the flop. If you don't charge anyone to see a flop, they can potentially sneak in with a drawing hand, then stack you when you "auto-bet" your overpair. Charge them to chase.

3. Keep your cards face down. Min-raise = usually overpair.

Pelion

01-29-2008, 04:18 PM

#15 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 3,206

everyone is so wrong about hand 3. He can have any A here. The fact he shows up with A2 proves that. Do people really think a donkey isnt stacking off with AJ here? or A7 for that matter. Im happy to get it in here.

gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.

bigspenda73: But how much did you win?

martindcx1e

01-29-2008, 05:14 PM

#16 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 3,614

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelion

agreed

Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.

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Why do i INSIST on calling these?!

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