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where's the money? - 25nl FR

  
 
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daven
Old 01-06-2010, 06:45 PM     Post subject: where's the money? - 25nl FR #1 (permalink)  
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 ok, so we all love 72-4 droolers. But...
so, how to exploit a typical off-peak deep table at 25nl:
exhibit A below. Thoughts?
HUD is
VPIP : PFR : 3-bet : steal
fold to 3-bet : 4b : cbet : fold cbet : hands
don't raise with the straight flush bro, nobody ever gonna call that shit
allin, reload, repeat

please read: http://www.philgalfond.com/lets-make-some-changes/
 
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celtic123
Old 01-06-2010, 08:21 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 Hers my stab.

GivemeChoren , 3bet him/ her light?
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JKDS
Old 01-06-2010, 09:12 PM #3 (permalink)  
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 Nah. No one really folds TT+ to a 3bet so its more than likely that the "fold to 3bet" sample size is small. Additionally we're not going to be in favorable position against him so we dont want to be 3betting too much. IE the only real time we'll be able to 3bet him is when we're on the button...but that means he'll be UTG...

One thing I'd do (assuming the green tag = fish for mr. bp309102) is id play alot of hands from the button here. Pretty much anything with even a little bit of value because we have a nit in the sb and someone whom likely also folds a bunch in the bb who doesnt 3bet very often (small sample). When he does call, Id like to play alot of pots against him, and i might even consider rebuying to 200bbs so that i max out when he floats oop and i have a good hand.
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jyms
Old 01-06-2010, 09:32 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 You don't really have enough hands on anyone to be doing anything but playing ABC. I also see no reason to sit at deep tables when nobody's deep except the strong players. The Your gonna make your money on this table by making good folds and playing big pots in position with strong draws. Forget TP and look to play SC's AXs and the likes.
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kmind
Old 01-06-2010, 09:40 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 I'd just try to get in hands vs. that davenigma guy. Seems terribad.

But seriously everyone seems to have leaks we can exploit.
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celtic123
Old 01-06-2010, 09:46 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 I see , so is 23/11 seen as the fishiest on the tble? and 21/14 the second fishiest ?

As in the bigger the Vpip & Pfr gap is indicative of fishmanship ?
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spoonitnow
Old 01-06-2010, 10:36 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 The only way I would not leave this table is if one of the people on my right was a huge fish. The stack size situation absolutely sucks here and there aren't any advantages here to compensate for it.
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JKDS
Old 01-06-2010, 11:41 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by celtic123
I see , so is 23/11 seen as the fishiest on the tble? and 21/14 the second fishiest ?

As in the bigger the Vpip & Pfr gap is indicative of fishmanship ?
the 21/14 is hero :P

but of the people here, we have a bunch of taggs, a nit, and this 23/11 guy so in terms of fishiness...we can exploit the 23/11 for a profit more easily than the others.
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surviva316
Old 01-06-2010, 11:45 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by spoonitnow
The only way I would not leave this table is if one of the people on my right was a huge fish. The stack size situation absolutely sucks here and there aren't any advantages here to compensate for it.
pretty much this. it's nice having that 7/5 to our left, though he's somehow managed a 4.2 3b over 200 hands (doesn't much make sense to me). i'd pretty much assume he's a complete nit who 3b's like TT+, AQ+, or is just on a heater or something until proven otherwise.

this gives us the opportunity to iso the 18/7 with a wide range, and it also allows us to open a wide range for value from both the CO and BU, knowing that the 23/11 prolly overcalls an exploitable amount.

all in all, though, there are a million better tables running at 25nl at any given moment
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daven
Old 01-07-2010, 06:05 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 "where's the money?"
the money is post-flop

point 1 - notes AND stats, it's the combination that matters. The player to my immediate right overplays mid-strength hands in big pots. This is not apparent from his stats, but it's always nice to sit next to someone who is gonna pay me off.

point 2 - "move tables, there are better". This is true. Keep an eye on how the tables you are at look relative to what you should have available to you at the stakes/site. Nothing wrong with sitting out and moving to a new table.

point 3 - position. As Jyms said, play hands in position. Play simple.

point 4 - button play, yep, steal wider than normal when bp is in the blinds. Hands vs a player like this and with position = where it's at. Also, there are going to be a lot of free steals cos 7-5 types aren't defending much

point 5 - post-flop. Several of these players have stats that indicate that their pre-flop play is ok (15-14-5, 12-9-5, 13-10-4, 17-11-3, 15-13-4), but they're all playing 25nl. So something must be wrong... Find out which are c-betting one street then giving up. Find out which are scared money.
don't raise with the straight flush bro, nobody ever gonna call that shit
allin, reload, repeat

please read: http://www.philgalfond.com/lets-make-some-changes/
 
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Micro2Macro
Old 01-08-2010, 12:22 AM #11 (permalink)  
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 On a table like this...

you could start by making sure your PFR is >20 although we could have a better seat to do this really (i.e. swap one of the nits with bp255517).

just run these guys the fuck over preflop they won't be able to handle aggression nor will they be able to adjust to playing more pots postflop because they suck so bad and when they do adjust they will do it all wrong/terrible and open themselves up to being exploited even more than if you just sit back and play your standard game.

you could probably get away with opening stuff like A5s in early position, as long as the loosest player isn't giving you any trouble.

to do this though you need to really be able to identify when to slow down and exercise really, really good emotional control to avoid spewing.
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