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| NckPlt |
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| Lately ive been playing alot and ive totalled all my winnings from this year and im -10. I have been going all in with straights and always getting beat by better calls. I was wondering what do you do if you constantly keep lossing like this. Ive been studying alot, playing alot, and stay at the same level so i dont lose tons of money. what should i do with loses like this and my bankroll. | |||
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Play for FREE and practice your game at...Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting! | ||||
| eeeee |
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| Chase bonuses. By chasing bonuses while you play, you may lose money, but you will earn bunuses while you improve your playing. | |||
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I'm a know-it-all.
No, really.
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| TLR |
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Read this forum Go over your hand history, post any hands you had trouble with Look for patterns of losing hands (outkicked, losing with str8 to better str8 or flush, overbetting, bluffing too much etc...) and fix those leaks |
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| aokrongly |
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Deleted I hope you printed this out. Unfortunately to protect the copyright I needed to delete it. Don't worry. It'll come out in the book. |
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| Pelion |
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Dont normally point out spellings but since its gunna be a book "Brick and Mortar" edit :actually theres quite alot in there.. Great post though 
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gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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| swiggidy |
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 Award for best response to a "What should I do to get better" noob post
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(\__/)
(='.'=) (")_(")
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| dalai007 |
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| AOK- First just wanted to thank you for all the insight you have shared with us here at FTR. It has helped my game for sure especially the know thyself thread. I will be reading every word of your above post slowly and carfully when I get a chance. Again thanks. | |||
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| Rondavu |
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During the part about poker betting conversations, I felt like you were inside my brain. I think the only difference between your approach and mine is that I will play very wide ranges in some situations against certain opponents who are bad enough to let me maximize value against them. I guess that's a big difference, even though I totally catch what you're throwing. In my opinion you lose a crapload of value to bad players when you only play a small range (such as 19 hands), since your opponents are making mistake after postflop mistake as you're camping for big hands. I could get some cash histories to illustrate. Are you going to have an advanced section to your book talking about proper open ranges and the motivation for them? I mean since mastering postflop play gives you a lot of allowance in that department. How will you address postflop play and what it is to master it? I think there could be a whole entire book called "Postflop" |
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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| DaNutsInYoEye |
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TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?
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| DaNutsInYoEye |
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TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?
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| relayer |
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| I just want to know when this book is to be published!!! | |||
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| Irisheyes |
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| Edited because Courtie beat me to it. | |||
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| aokrongly |
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we are doing the book, Irish!!! This is me getting back into it! Have no fear! We still have ALOT of pages to write. We're about 10% through it. So have no fear. Did you see the 2.5 section on Performance Poker site? That's new. I'll be adding more tonight. Plus I put toghether this first section. I think it sounds great and reflects well on the crew on edudlive who are making this book what it is. ****** to answer the question on the big blink - that's big BLIND. So it's not some magical thing. ********** For all those who want to point out misspellingggs, wrung word choices. bad'd pun.tuation,s, etc. Please rest assured that they won't make it into the final print version, or even the final electronic "for sale" version. So, don't fill the thread with editing pointers. ********* When it comes to making comments on the CONTENTS, feel free. I need to know what people think and how doing the same has applied or doing something different has worked. I'm interested. I should make this a sticky and just do it up front, but I REALLY like burying gems in unnoticed threads. I really like doing that. Finally, for all those advanced players who are reading and thinking "this is too limiting with 19 hands". First, it's not and the rest of the book explains how to maximize the 19 hands, pick sites, pick tables, etc. etc. Next, The final sections of the book will be about how to develop YOUR OWN performance game not limited to the exact tactics I lay out in the book. But if I tried to do that before showing what a true, disciplined, performance oriented game looks like then it would be useless. Thanks. Keep commenting. |
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| Xanadu |
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| I haven't read it yet, just saw your comment on how long it was and scrolled down. Damn, AOK, that is the longest post I have seen 3x over (not counting those infernal 40 hand histories I hate). I thought my posts were long ... | |||
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| AKicker |
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I for one, would like to thank Aokrongly for this interesting and insightful article. It already has given me pointers to fix my game. And be assured that when the print copy is out, I'm buying. |
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| KingLizard |
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Put me down for a 1st run copy ... signed of course. |
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| Irisheyes |
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| Xanadu |
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| KingLizard |
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| aokrongly |
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the site for the development is http://edudlive.com/forums/index.php The vast majority of the site is private. There is a public area where you can see some previews. New things will be posted from time to time. However, I normally post them on FTR as well. |
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| Vrax |
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| Kaizen the Round One writes g00t. | |||
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"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy
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| cobere |
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Heya AOk, thanks for the post. Good stuff. One thing I tried doing tonight that will undoubtedly reinforce the starting hand selection - mentally say "I always fold xx" as you're reaching for the fold button. So it went like this: "I always fold K6o" cobere32 folds. "I always fold A9o" cobere32 folds. "I always fold 73s" cobere32 folds. "Ooooh, pocket Kings, I play those. I reraise with a raise in front, open raise if folded to me, and call a reraise behind my raise." cobere32 wins a lot of money. "I always fold KTs" cobere32 folds. I'm sure this will burn the concept into my brain of what not to play. |
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| aokrongly |
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| lol cool | |||
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| JetA_Jockey |
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| aok, I want a copy of this book. I enjoyed reading the section you posted up here, and this is definitely something I will be reading cover to cover. You'll do great with it I'm sure. | |||
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help me pay for my 454
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| kashpot |
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AOK, OK, Here is my initial observation on playing the 19 hands and 19 hands only. After reading this post, i sat down at one table and increased my stack while playing only 3 hands in 45 minutes. It was 4:45 am and i needed to go to bed. Well, this morning I got up and I played on 2-4 tables for 3 hours. Increasing my roll even more. Along the way, I will say that I still may a couple of mistakes. One of which was costly. I was so juiced up on my table image that I couldnt hear my opponent 'telling" me that he had me beat. Expensive lesson. Performance poker in the sense of the word, if i am correct requires DISCIPLINE and PATIENCE. The discipline to throw away those hands that you are use to playing but now are no longer a part of your frat. I mucked EVERY Ax hand that I got! Suited or none, it didn't matter. If I had KJ in the hole and the was Axx,fold. As for my opponents, initially, they would call my raise and see the flop. Chase their draws. Call with Ax when I had AK or AQ. Go to the river with me with Kx. Not one hand was I playing a dominated hand on four tables. I'd get AQ and raise the pot maybe 5-7xBB and players began to scurry away and I'd only one caller or just the blinds. Should I adjust my betting so that players would get a clear read on me? Playing like today. I could see moving up to another level and feeling confident in my game that I am entering pots with the best of it. |
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Operation PAYDAY:
22 FEB 06 $30 current $136.00
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| Jiggus |
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AoK, the improvement in my game and the growth of my bankroll is proof of the efficacy of your system. And I've only seen 10% of the book, as you say. 19 hands may seem limiting to some, but it's a fabulous way to build confidence. From that basis, you can start experimenting based on other factors, but that foundation of 19 starting hands has been the best thing for me, and I'm sure for many others. Muchas Gracias, mate. |
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| aokrongly |
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to answer these question, the next step is to learn betting patterns and use them to disguise your hands. takes intentional pauses in betting that confuse your opponents and keep them interested in hands you're winning, etc. Ther's alot more to performance poker than 19 hands - but it's a powerful start isn't it? i'm glad to hear about the results. I do have this one warning, however: PERFORMANCE POKER IS AN ENTIRE SYSTEM OF PLAY. THE POSTED SECTION ABOVE IS JUST 10% OF THAT SYSTEM, AND AS SUCH IS NOT AS EFFECTIVE AS THE ENTIRE SYSTEM. Also, there are precursors, caveats, concepts, disciplines, decisions, knowledge, etc. that is Critical to winning at performance poker long term. It's not in this post. Much of it hasn't been written yet. So don't completely judge performance poker by this post - GOOD OR BAD. This is just something I though people could use. |
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| r8ed |
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| People need to back off AOK regarding everything. The guy played poker to pay the bills and support his family (high stress) while writing this book. Then he went back to work at 60hrs per week while still trying to keep the book going. Some people insinuate that he's letting them down somehow. WTF?? He's giving away invaluable information in a format that is extremely easy to comprehend and apply for FREE! I would have quit poker if it was not for him because I don't like pissing away money. How many people used his teachings or system to generate profits? I did. You want $500 from me AOK with no strings attached? Say the word - it will be in your neteller today. Sure it would hurt my bankroll, but I wouldn't have a bankroll without your guidance. Thank you for taking the time and please keep posting on FTR. People appreciate what you contribute. | |||
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| swiggidy |
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Quote:
No one is complaining that they aren't getting the whole book. They want to know how to buy it (when available), or they are happy that a free 10% of a book made them a better player. |
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(\__/)
(='.'=) (")_(")
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| r8ed |
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| Some people got on him here and other places and I think it would be a bad thing for him to stop contributing. Nobody should get all over him about letting them down because he didn't finish the book in the aggressive timeframe he originally slated. | |||
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| kashpot |
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Wow!!! r8ed. Fire off them rockets.. I kinda understand where he is going with this. Last night, I was in another area of this forum and members were ragging on AOK kinda fierce. At one point AOK mentioned if "we'd" like it, he could leave FTR and not post here anymore. I would say that that would be a bad mistake. There are a number of noobs and fledging Phil Iveys (me ) out there who would lose out invaluable information without his insights. I enjoy FTR, but AOK has added a level of genius to this site that needs to be embraced. Back to poker, Yeah Aok, I am hearing you loud and clear. You reeled me in with you post on PERFORMANCE POKER now I'm sitting at the starting line with a Nascar with no gas! What I mean is, maybe you could discuss posflop play in your next addition of Performan Poker? Today when my hand hit on the flop, I bet out strong; gunning at the pot. However, when my AJ missed me on the flop or I have a straight/flush draw; what next? Do I bet, check or fold? |
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Operation PAYDAY:
22 FEB 06 $30 current $136.00
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| NckPlt |
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| OMG i cant even begin to thank you for all of this...i mean ive improved my game so much as soon as the book comes out please reserve a copy for me. | |||
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| NckPlt |
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| Now say you have cards that are suited in your hand should you play them looking for the flush or what? I have been having trouble with them lately | |||
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| Soulless |
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best post ive read... printed, stamped and resting at my bedroomtable, ill read it once everytime i go to bed until i feel its in my head |
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"It's sickening to see dreams die"
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| Pelion |
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If you have T3s then play it the same way you play T3o (i.e. fold preflop). Hands like 67s can be limped in late position and played for the flush or straight. |
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gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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| Rabid Dog |
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| dj newman |
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| Great post AOK....can't wait for the rest. I had a general feeling of the conversations in my head while I was playing before, but writing them down like you have done has made a lot more sense in my head. | |||
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| aokrongly |
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(thanks for standing up for me. I appreciate how you appreciate what I'm trying to do. Don't sweat it and let it go. We're trying to do something cool. ALOT of people are helping me. I appreciate them all. A few are kicking my ass on this book, which I appreciate as well. Basically the reality is I can either write the damn book, or I can make excuses and apologies. I hate apologizing and I can't think of any excuses. To anyone who understand the $500 reference, don't sweat it... REALLY! For those who want to send me money. I'm not that kind of guy. final word on this - I HATE DRAMA. So let's just focus on the book. And I do appreciate people who push me to keep writing it. It's about respecting people who have spend ALOT OF TIME reading, editing, caring and working on this thing. For every hour I spend writing a crew of 30 spends 20 hours reading and commenting (on the performance review site). I won't ignore their contributions. THANK YOU. And I'm not going anywhere. I promise. I'm to much of an egomaniac to do that. lol) BACK TO THE BOOK. This is a no drama zone I'm feeling you on what to do postflop. Just play how you think best until I can write this damn thing. A few tips - , make em pay if you hit. Continuation bets are useless against 3 or more preflop callers, but work well against 1 or 2. Know drawing odds and play accordingly. Position matters. Make "moves" not bluffs. (i know you're going to ask what moves.) ... see why it takes a book. Plus - get this, in the end of the book i'll tell you how to play AGAINST performance poker. Here's a short list of the topics I'm trying to cover. As you learn lessons write them down raised and reraised pot preflop with pocket pair never hide mistakes small blind is sucker punch postion righty tight lefty loosie selecting a nl ring table playing reads (when you're too good for your own good) feeling lucky Principles Based Poker - what is it focus is like endurance postiion = info period Strong bets = valid information making moves vs bluffing is poker risky the donkey kick hand pattern recognition basic - non-pattern reads watch what people raise with call raised pots with preflop - observation 3 ways people get paid for raiseing poor or drawing cards prflop keep a poker journal specialize each game has a hidden goal - learn it why i can't "fix" your game how to wipe the slate and learn a new game - beliefs and tools record every hand current face of poker and why perf poker is diff. psychology of tilt, winning, losing you have to understand why not just what step 1 you don't know how to play poker current poker books are not performance oriented i fold coversations pattern recognition slowplaying when the big bet is a mistake - it creates action instead of scaring it away why make a big bet when a small one will do chips are not money creating a winning environment what do you want from poker what does your family think how do you feel this is a very intimate book goals or expectations - there is a huge difference peer group dynamics writing sentences - the pill that cures managing disappointment time pressure and bad play keeping honest records who are you going to listen to money matters - br management, philosophies and beliefs poker players are lost in a sea of desperation, frustration and confusion how to focus the value of money and playing with credits = ying/yang playing the RIGHT stakes finding a game/site why position matters write an essay on every hand you play how to change your beliefs repetitious writing creates habits and molds perceptions you can change reality by changing yourslef there is one important key to every game getting Mrs. on board Your "other" life - spend time there too getting "result" obsessed the joy of poker counter-play pot odds, drawing odds, and other poker realities I'm not a robot! only pros make money long term method vs resuts rewarding your own bad play and punishing your own good play? setting patterns in your brain playing 'through' tilt poker genius syndrome perma-tilt learned helplessness newbie syndrome how to mentally approach poker nl ring is a time game don't try to hit home runs your environment get rich quick? right, and then what? get poor slow? you playing for fun or profit how to select a game record keeping monitoring yourself, emotions and situation consistency is everything performance poker is rules based know thyself poker is one big session play alot of tablees wher you can win most consistently it's not what you know it's what habits you instill showing and not showing hopes and dreams poker when you think "one more round" or "10 more minutes" leave play same game 1st to last programming yourself for success there's a tear in my beer - bad beat bullshit how to play each hand in a vaccuum the poker cycle careful play is not weak patterns that you create that make you money straights - the biggest secret in nl ring cash money out kaizen - how to learn i'm a genius, i suck - syndrome smiling realeases endorphins what does play like a pro mean? |
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| aokrongly |
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| yea, cards aren't SUITED preflop to me. They might BE suited but I ignore it preflop. AFter the flop if I hit a flush or flush draw NOW THEY'RE SUITED and I care. But that's just me. | |||
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| DBL0SVN |
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 wow - can't wait for the book Aok. And take all the time you need - it's going to be well worth the wait! |
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| dj newman |
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This is just me AOK...but I think you should make it more comprehensive...
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| kashpot |
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Good Grief!!!! What are you attempting to do? Replace Super Systems? Man o' man is that some material. In order to cover that kind of material, you'd have to have a book as thick as Super Systems or HOH. On the book, take as much time as you need and thoroughly explain you thoughts on each topic. For me, the difference between a great manual on poker, or any other subject, is the authors' committment to going the extra mile. Not just slapping together a couple of ideas and saying here. |
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Operation PAYDAY:
22 FEB 06 $30 current $136.00
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| aokrongly |
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It's not that bad. I like to think I can cut to the heart of the matter, and many topics in poker are very "aha, so THAT'S IT" once you're exposed to the concept properly. 3-4 paragraphs. But, don't worry about it. I'm trying to crank out 20 pages a week, which might be ambitious. about 60 pages of raw text are written to this point. I wrote 5 today. If I can get 20 out per week, then let's say summer for a rough draft. Which was my goal when I began. |
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| NckPlt |
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| Hey aok thanks for all of this advice it has been really helping...well i was also wondering what does the T's stand for in the first reply im having trouble understanding that. | |||
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| Rabid Dog |
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T=10 Is that what your looking for? |
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| Irisheyes |
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| swiggidy |
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(\__/)
(='.'=) (")_(")
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| swiggidy |
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(\__/)
(='.'=) (")_(")
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| Rabid Dog |
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Here's an easy way to remember the 19 hands. Short of writing them down and pasting them on your monitor, which isnt a bad idea. Any hand with a T (10) or below in it you fold. With the exception of pocket T's. |
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| Renton |
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Great post. One comment tho and this has probably been asked before. How do you get action when you only play ten percent of hands? |
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| Latest Poker News | |
| KoRnholio |
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
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| According to an email sent out by Mark Bryan, a gaming analyst at Merrill Lynch, the Australian government plans to legalize online poker sometime in the next six to 12 months. This move will coincide ... | |
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