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journey075
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05-23-2005, 10:49 PM
Post subject: Value of QJo
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 725
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worth playing in mid/late positon for a limp? ive been limping QJo a lot in mid-late and it seems to be a leak. i think its a hand that has potential so im not sure if dropping it completely is the smartest option. would like to hear thoughts though.
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Bmxicle
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 947
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I generally like to raise it when its folded around to me in the last four positions. I either steal the blinds, or bet about 3/4 of the pot on almost all flops if i'm called. If i'm still being called on the flop then i just ditch it if i haven't hit.
This isn't a hand you want to get into big confrontations with, but useful for raising with position against tight players.
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FishMagician
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 206
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
I generally like to raise it when its folded around to me in the last four positions. I either steal the blinds, or bet about 3/4 of the pot on almost all flops if i'm called. If i'm still being called on the flop then i just ditch it if i haven't hit.
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Theeggman
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 363
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
This isn't a hand you want to get into big confrontations with, but useful for raising with position against tight players.
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Can't any 2 accomplish that?
I hate QJo because it's so easily dominated. To me it only has str8 potential. Looks pretty though, that's the allure IMO.
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I'll be a rootin' tootin' shootin' damn fool, protectin' my chips.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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i limp with it initially .. if its raised, i will only call the raise if i have position on the raiser and he has a deep stack.
flop misses me .. i fold, otherwise im going to move all in on him with 2 pair or better.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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Theeggman
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 363
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Element, what about playing it for TPGK?
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I'll be a rootin' tootin' shootin' damn fool, protectin' my chips.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Theeggman
Element, what about playing it for TPGK?
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i prefer hitting 3 of a kind or better before being too agressive ...
if i hit top pair good kicker, i'll throw a bet about the size of the pot, see who calls, work with my information from that point on.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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FishMagician
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 206
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
This isn't a hand you want to get into big confrontations with, but useful for raising with position against tight players.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Theeggman
Can't any 2 accomplish that?
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Yes. The point is QJo isn't much of a hand.
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Bmxicle
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 947
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Theeggman
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
This isn't a hand you want to get into big confrontations with, but useful for raising with position against tight players.
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Can't any 2 accomplish that?
I hate QJo because it's so easily dominated. To me it only has str8 potential. Looks pretty though, that's the allure IMO. |
Pretty much, I will often make this play with any two cards depending on how tight the players are in the blinds but you can't always be afraid of domination, you just need to be a bit more cautious when you do hit something.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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QJ is pretty weak. I play it from late position for cheap, don't like coming in with it from middle position really. It's a good hand for two pair or straights. It's a mediocre hand for top pair/good kicker situations, unless there aren't that many playing and you have position.
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 2,667
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dalecooper
QJ is pretty weak. I play it from late position for cheap, don't like coming in with it from middle position really. It's a good hand for two pair or straights. It's a mediocre hand for top pair/good kicker situations, unless there aren't that many playing and you have position.
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"It's a good hand for two pair," is another way of saying "it's not a good hand."
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dsaxton
Quote:
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Originally Posted by dalecooper
QJ is pretty weak. I play it from late position for cheap, don't like coming in with it from middle position really. It's a good hand for two pair or straights. It's a mediocre hand for top pair/good kicker situations, unless there aren't that many playing and you have position.
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"It's a good hand for two pair," is another way of saying "it's not a good hand." |
Not quite. What I mean is that if you have two pair with this hand, it's usually going to be top two and you can be pretty comfortable that you have the best hand. That gives any two high cards a nudge more value than two randomly selected cards, where you might still make two pair, but it would be top and bottom, or bottom two. But I emphasize the "straights" portion of the above. I'd rather play QJ for straights than anything else; you'll make more money and end up with the losing hand less often.
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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QJs is a very slight winner for me and QJo is a very slight loser for me over 10k hands at 2/4 NL.
-'rilla
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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journey075
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 725
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
QJs is a very slight winner for me and QJo is a very slight loser for me over 10k hands at 2/4 NL.
-'rilla
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thats good enough for me.
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Bmxicle
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 947
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by journey075
Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
QJs is a very slight winner for me and QJo is a very slight loser for me over 10k hands at 2/4 NL.
-'rilla
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thats good enough for me. |
Not really, you lose one big pot with that hand and your stats are hugely influenced in only 10k hands.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
Not really, you lose one big pot with that hand and your stats are hugely influenced in only 10k hands.
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"Hugely" influenced? In 10,000 hands you should be dealt QJo about 90 times (if my math is right). One or two big pots, plus or minus, will come out in the wash over that many hands. Arguably if you lost five big pots, that would result in a significant downward turn on your QJo average - but then, if I lose 5 big pots with a hand in 90 tries, I start to think maybe that should be telling me something, either about my play or about the value of the hand.
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Dynamyk
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 9
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I will limp in mid - to late. Raise if I'm on the button to show strength preflop.
QJ hits a lot of two pairs for me, i still fold in early position.
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bmxicle
Quote:
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Originally Posted by journey075
Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
QJs is a very slight winner for me and QJo is a very slight loser for me over 10k hands at 2/4 NL.
-'rilla
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thats good enough for me. |
Not really, you lose one big pot with that hand and your stats are hugely influenced in only 10k hands. |
Common! This is me we're talkin about! I don't dump huge pots!
-'rilla
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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