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RakeSmart
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04-12-2005, 08:28 AM
Post subject: Types Of Players Who Bleed Money In NL
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 11
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1. At the top of the list obviously, the loose passive player
2. Next the maniac; if he's catching, he can be a problem, but if he doubles or triples up, the game can be good all night.
3. This is the important type, as many players on this board who wonder why they don't win more, or even emerge as slight losers might fall into this category. The tight/passive/passive player.
This player voluntarily puts money into the pot pre flop less than 20% of the time. He raise less than 5% (usually around 2%) preflop. He is decidedly unaggressive post flop. He constantly wonders what his oppponents have, thus sees monsters, and never seems to win what he thinks the should.
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 2,667
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Apparently my style of waiting for hands and betting them leads to losing money. At least that's how it's been for three days straight.
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DogOnMySide
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04-12-2005, 02:09 PM
Post subject: Re: Types Of Players Who Bleed Money In NL
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#3 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 458
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RakeSmart.com
The tight/passive/passive player.
This player voluntarily puts money into the pot pre flop less than 20% of the time. He raise less than 5% (usually around 2%) preflop. He is decidedly unaggressive post flop. He constantly wonders what his oppponents have, thus sees monsters, and never seems to win what he thinks the should.
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This sounds a bit like me in ring games.
Only happens in ring games though, and only because my bankroll isn't sufficient. I think it's the fear of losing all your cash in one big mistake. In SnG's i know i can only lose a fiver or something, and tend to play much, much better.
I also think playing tight puts me on tilt, in the sense that after not playing a hand for ages, when i join in i immediately expect the worst...
i have AKo against one other player
flop comes Ah 2h 4h and i think "hes got a flush im going to lose everything!" before he even bets/checks.
So basically yeah, i think the type of player you describe might be an OK player, operating outside the limits of his bankroll.
If such a thing exists!
First post by the way. Hi. Love this forum.
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The Lizard King
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 20
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The other night I was watching someone (a fellow called Elky) play in the 10/20 NL table at Stars. And there was this player there called Michael1123 or something similar to that. Anyway this Michael dude was raising ~95% of the pots preflop, and raising/betting all the time postflop, regardles of his cards. In other words he looked like an aggressive maniac to me (though I would say a smart agg maniac). Anyway, while Michael is stealing the blinds constantly and winning most of the big pots, the entire table is in super tight/passive mode, waiting for monster hands so they could take Michaels stack.
Now normally, just as the opening post mentioned, agg maniacs usually bled away their money at NL tables, but these guy was the exact opposite - the first hand I saw was when he lost a ~8k pot to Elky when Elky hit one of his 4 outs on the river, then a while later he lost another huge pot which left him with like 2k, but honestly within about 90 minutes he had turned that 2k back into ~20k. It was unbelievable. Makes me want to be an aggressive maniac, lol.
Hmm now that I think about it this post isnt really contributing anything useful to the thread.... oh well.
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ender555
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 647
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haha
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SmackinYaUp
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: B N L
Posts: 1,725
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by The Lizard King
The other night I was watching someone (a fellow called Elky) play in the 10/20 NL table at Stars. And there was this player there called Michael1123 or something similar to that. Anyway this Michael dude was raising ~95% of the pots preflop, and raising/betting all the time postflop, regardles of his cards. In other words he looked like an aggressive maniac to me (though I would say a smart agg maniac). Anyway, while Michael is stealing the blinds constantly and winning most of the big pots, the entire table is in super tight/passive mode, waiting for monster hands so they could take Michaels stack.
Now normally, just as the opening post mentioned, agg maniacs usually bled away their money at NL tables, but these guy was the exact opposite - the first hand I saw was when he lost a ~8k pot to Elky when Elky hit one of his 4 outs on the river, then a while later he lost another huge pot which left him with like 2k, but honestly within about 90 minutes he had turned that 2k back into ~20k. It was unbelievable. Makes me want to be an aggressive maniac, lol.
Hmm now that I think about it this post isnt really contributing anything useful to the thread.... oh well. |
was this on pokerstars? i would love to watch michael play some NL ring games
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The Lizard King
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 20
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yes it was one of the 10/20 NL tables at Stars. Trust me, its great to watch him. He was purely dominating the entire table, got a couple bad beats to dwindle his stack down to like 2k, then he managed to get it up to 20k in like 90 minutes. Great fun to watch and seems like a nice player.
His style of play at that passive table was superb IMO.
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Legendash
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Full House
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Crypto 6max 100NL
Posts: 611
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Lizard, you do know michael1123 an FTR regular right? I never knew he was so aggro, interesting.
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"[This theory] is only useful for helping to calculate your luck odds. If you have a good read that you have a numerical advantage against your opponent, that your hand is "luckier"..."
Copyright, Youngdro 2007.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Legendash
Lizard, you do know michael1123 an FTR regular right? I never knew he was so aggro, interesting.
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havent you seen his tournament winnings?
you dont win waiting for monsters.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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jmontis
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Full House
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,296
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few people can master the maniac style of play. I am getting better at it, although I take the worst of it when someone with 55 feels like sucking out and hits his 2 outter because i've bluffed and raised the last 5 hands. It's definitely winning poker though if you know when to shift gears.
you NEED to play well within your bankroll though, because it's swingy at first, but once you get the hang of it you'll be leaving tables with 3-4x what you came with.
If the table is tight I like raising in late position with any hand for about 5-6 rounds, and if you flop some random 2 pair against AA, you're in good shape.
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michael1123
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Posts: 1,720
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Haha, funny that Lizard didn't know I posted here. I'm not quite as maniacal as I seem in NL ring, but I'm certainly loose aggressive, and I do raise about 50% of hands preflop, and usually fire a bet out at the flop, as long as it doesn't look too scary, irregardless of whether I've hit anything or not.
The reason this type of play works is the deep stacks compared to the blinds. Pots won or lost preflop or at the flop are rather insignificant, while pots won at a showdown with heavy betting on each street get very large. With my play I greatly loosen up the quality of hands that most of the players require to take it down to a showdown, meaning that I'm likely to win much larger pots on average when I do hit a hand.
Similarly I'll often make crazy calls against small stacks. Seeing me raise 4xBB with 75o and then call an all in raise from a short stack for $200 more may be the difference between a big stack later calling a pot sized bet of $3k on the river when I have the nuts or laying his hand down.
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bigred
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PROFESSIONAL TROLL
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Nest of Douchebags
Posts: 2,184
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I still think you only make money because of your kickass stick figure... 
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