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Gshark
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03-04-2009, 08:03 PM
Post subject: TT on the button - can I put him on a bluff?
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#1 (permalink)
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 65
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PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
saw flop
MP ($2.89)
CO ($1)
Hero (Button) ($5.62)
Villain ($2.98)
BB ($7.33)
UTG ($5.61)
Preflop: Hero is Button with 10 , 10
3 folds, Hero calls $0.02, Villain calls $0.01, BB checks
Flop: ($0.06) 8, 3 , 6 (3 players)
Villain checks, BB checks, Hero bets $0.06, Villain calls $0.06, 1 fold
Turn: ($0.18) 5 (2 players)
Villain checks, Hero bets $0.10, Villain calls $0.10
River: ($0.38) K (2 players)
Villain bets $0.22, Hero ???
Ok, so I know this might seem like a standard fold, but this guy was really erratic. I don't have stats, but he has been bluffing at "huge" (I mean this is .01/.02) pots and showing his hand (he got me off a best hand on the river about 15 min before), but he has also been showing his hand when he has the nuts and gets everyone to fold. Not sure what his deal is, but I'm starting to get a good read on him since he, kindly, never mucks his hand.
I thought that slow playing TT was alright at this table since I've been playing a little aggressively. And I'm OTB so I figure what the hell.
Do any of you call or raise here? How's my line? Thanks.
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tuuk2
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Flush
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: East Hartford
Posts: 296
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I think I call here. You're getting almost 3-1 odds to make the call so it's certainly worth it. The problem I see with re-raising is that you're only going to get called or re-raised by a better hand. He could have backdoored a flush, although I'm betting against it.
He could also have caught that King and have you beaten. Calling is certainly the safest option. I don't think I can fold here, especially if the Villain is as LAG as you say he is.
The other thing to look at is, I don't know if I'd call this a bluff kind of bet. It seems to be more of a value bet. If it is a bluff, it's a very poor one. Anyone who gives his opponent 3 to 1 odds to call a bluff is not thinking straight, unless it's a Post-Oak Bluff which I'm guessing is pretty rare at this level.
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Carroters
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Da Amberlamps
Posts: 2,216
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Never (very rearely) open limp the button 6 max, you're not even slowplaying with a hand like 1010 you're just giving the blinds a free flop and failing to get value from your hand preflop when it's usually at it's strongest.
Flop is fine but you need to bet the turn harder and make him pay for his lose stationy donk ways. River is dependant on your read, if he's really that bluffy a call isn't horrible. My concern is though I can't find a hand that villain can continue with on the flop or turn that doesn't have showdown value or isn't now a made nut type hand. I think fold is best even though he's spewy.
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Gshark
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 65
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tuuk2
The other thing to look at is, I don't know if I'd call this a bluff kind of bet. It seems to be more of a value bet. If it is a bluff, it's a very poor one. Anyone who gives his opponent 3 to 1 odds to call a bluff is not thinking straight, unless it's a Post-Oak Bluff which I'm guessing is pretty rare at this level.
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See that's what was making me think this WAS a bluff. He didn't seem to know what value bet meant in earlier hands. I mean, when you have a full house and no one is calling big bets, why would you go all in for 6x the pot (which he did earlier).
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Gshark
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 65
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Carroters
Never (very rearely) open limp the button 6 max, you're not even slowplaying with a hand like 1010 you're just giving the blinds a free flop and failing to get value from your hand preflop when it's usually at it's strongest.
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You're probably right, but I've been sort of experimenting at this level lately. I've been finding that most raises pf go uncalled, although, maybe I didn't have to worry about that with this villain.
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Carroters
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Da Amberlamps
Posts: 2,216
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If raises go uncalled a lot in your games then steal the blinds lots by opening up you raising range and give yourself a loser image from the CO and Button. This way you can make extra cash from all the times they fold, build an image to get paid on your big hands, and not need to feel like you have to limp strong hands pre flop, because in 6 max it's honestly not the way to go.
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xpaand
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 289
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Is it wrong to fold? I feel like even though he might be bluffing, there's a strong chance that he might have hit a low end flush or a pair of K's.
Although if I was in this situation I'd probably re-raise him to call his bluff, but I think that's the wrong move. Is it?
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OP: Beginner to Master
If I bet as a bluff, I should be thinking "am I getting better hands to fold? Is it likely that he will fold x% of the time to a y sized bet to make it +EV?". If I bet for value, I should be thinking "am I getting worst hands to call? Am I ahead of enough of his range that this is a good value bet?".
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texa8
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Straight
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 207
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Quote:
I feel like even though he might be bluffing, there's a strong chance that he might have hit a low end flush or a pair of K's.
Although if I was in this situation I'd probably re-raise him to call his bluff, but I think that's the wrong move. Is it?
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why, if you feel there is a strong chance u are beat, would you re-raise to call his bluff?
i just call here. if you're beat, take note of his cards and his line on each of the streets. does he call mid-range flops with overs? does he cold call flush draws on turn? or his he capable of making big bluffs on scare cards? etc..
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kmind
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
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I mean obviously if your read is 100% correct we have to at least call but I think you lost the hand and you posted it. Raising preflop is a huge mistake as we miss value/don't get to narrow down his range (yet keep it wide). It really depends how often he enters pots. He can easily show up with two pair/straight if he is semi-tight and he can show up with anything if he plays a lot of hands. I'd take that into consideration knowing that he CAN bluff showdownable hands.
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