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Trivial bet sizing question - extracting value

  
 
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Biglines
Old 09-21-2008, 01:34 PM     Post subject: Trivial bet sizing question - extracting value #1 (permalink)  
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How much should I be betting here on the turn? I want to avoid scaring the other players off, but at the same time there is a flush draw on the board.

Not sure if I sized the flop bet right either for extracting value.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($3.69)
SB ($4.01)
BB ($2.01)
UTG ($3.32)
MP ($2.86)
Hero (CO) ($2)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q, K
UTG calls $0.02, MP calls $0.02, Hero (poster) raises to $0.12, 1 fold, SB calls $0.11, 1 fold, UTG calls $0.10, MP calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.50) A, 10, J (4 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $0.20, SB calls $0.20, UTG calls $0.20, 1 fold

Turn: ($1.10) 3 (3 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, Hero ???,
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Biglines
Old 09-21-2008, 01:43 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Biglines
Here´s another hand. What should I be betting on the river? no reads on the player

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (4 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($5.84)
Button ($2.01)
Hero (SB) ($1.99)
BB ($3.08)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, 5
1 fold, Button calls $0.02, Hero calls $0.01, BB checks

Flop: ($0.06) 9, 7, 2 (3 players)
Hero bets $0.04, 1 fold, Button calls $0.04

Turn: ($0.14) 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $0.12, Button calls $0.12

River: ($0.38) K (2 players)
Hero ??
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bigstock2001
Old 09-21-2008, 03:28 PM #3 (permalink)  
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bigstock2001
IMO I would put a bet of .75 I would not be as concerned with the flush draw as I would be the straight draw causing a bad card on the river making you split. The back door flush is there but I dont think you are facing that. IMO
Don
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cardsman1992
Old 09-21-2008, 03:57 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Hand one I like .70-.90.

Hand 2 don't always complete sooted crap. River I bet .25-.30
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Old 09-22-2008, 01:27 AM #5 (permalink)  
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H1 bet 90 cents on the turn
fish don't generally think about the difference between 70 cents and 90, but 1 dollar looks bigger so psychologically they lean towards folding more

hand 2, keep going with the same bet sizing, slightly under pot
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daven
Old 09-22-2008, 03:15 AM #6 (permalink)  
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 hand 1: ffs bet the flop harder!!! 35-40 please. As played bet turn $0.95
hand 2: nice play on flop and turn, bet river 80% pot.
don't raise with the straight flush bro, nobody ever gonna call that shit
allin, reload, repeat

please read: http://www.philgalfond.com/lets-make-some-changes/
 
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d0zer
Old 09-22-2008, 03:25 AM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daven
hand 1: ffs bet the flop harder!!! 35-40 please. As played bet turn $0.95
hand 2: nice play on flop and turn, bet river 80% pot.
Yes this.

Tho I'd bet hand1's flop even harder. pot size given it's a 3-way and at these stakes you can get gooooot value from all sorts of hands they could be calling a preflop raise with. Pair + gutshot, 2pr, Ax etc will probably be along for the ride.

Against loose players I tend to worry less about 'scaring them out', and more about missing value.
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Biglines
Old 09-22-2008, 05:49 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Biglines
For hand 1, normally would make a post sized bet on flop. However, as it was checked round to me thought it was unlikely that one of the opp had an A and so I wasnt going to get much action.
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SiCK_Boy
Old 09-22-2008, 07:02 AM #9 (permalink)  

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SiCK_Boy
About the first hand you posted, I wouln't worry too much about the flush... With that kind of flop, you'll probably be facing trips or two pairs by the time you get to the showdown, which you already beat.

Your main concern should be to find a way to put all of your money in the pot without frightening your opponents. You've got 1,68 $ left by the turn. Go with at least a 0,50 $ bet. You'll be able to push the rest in on the river.

The fact that you have position limits the implied odds of your opponents (if a third spade comes in and they bet strong on the river, you can always fold. Thus, they'd get a 2,50 $ pot for a 0,50 $ bet, or 5:1, which is about the odds they have of hitting that spade). If they keep calling the turn, I'd say they have already some made hands (even more so if they both keep playing), so you should be fine.

Everyone seems to be arguing for a larger flop bet. What is the point? He's got the nut after the flop, what's the urge to go strong? Look like a bluff so he gets called more often? If some of the other posters could expend on their answer, I'd love to read their reasoning and thought process.

On the second hand, your bet should be based on your evaluation of the chances your opponent has a bigger flush than yours. If your opponent doesn't have the flush, he'll probably fold if you bet anything bigger than 0,15 $ (that, or he'll try to bluff you). If he does have it, you could very well face a raise if you bet. So you should consider your reaction to a raise if you choose to bet.

Personnaly, I'd go with a small bet (about 0,15 $) and see what he does. If he overreacts with a shove, I'd call, thinking he bluffs. If he goes with a smaller raise (between 0,30 $ and 0,50 $), I'd start thinking and maybe fold... the problem with a flop like that one (3 cards of the same suit) is that everyone can easily represent the flush.
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