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Gobbatino
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05-31-2009, 02:54 PM
Post subject: TPTK, good fold or fail fold?
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 341
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Absolute/UB Cereus No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Absolute/UB Cereus Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
saw flop
Hero (Button) ($10.30)
SB ($8.36)
BB ($12.13)
UTG ($12.69)
MP ($15.98)
CO ($4.50)
Preflop: Hero is Button with K , A
UTG calls $0.10, 2 folds, Hero bets $0.50, 2 folds, UTG calls $0.40
Flop: ($1.15) A , J , 4 (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $0.80, UTG raises to $2, Hero calls $1.20
Turn: ($5.15) 6 (2 players)
UTG bets $5.15, Hero folds
Total pot: $5.15 | Rake: $0.25
Unfortunately I had no reads on Villain, I just sat down at the table. I felt he was showing too much strength to call, put him on a set or two pair. The limp/call PF could be indicative of 44, A4 or even AJ? Was this too nitty?
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Illfavor
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Denton, TX
Posts: 1,152
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nh.
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Ich grolle nicht...
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NoPantsPoker
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 17
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Check raises at this level usually mean TPTK are beat. Plus, like you said limp calling from early position are a lot of small PP.
Folding isn't bad imo. Although I'm not happy about it..
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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This action splits on reads: about 1/3 of villains I played at 10nl I would stack off here against, about 2/3's not. Absolute was terribly passive when I played there, so the c/r flop would have me shutting down, trying to check it down or check/call an expensive river.
I don't want you thinking TPTK is an autofold to "flop c/r turn donk", though, 'cuz it's not. We just need to find the right reads to continue here maybe 25% to 50% of the time, depending on your game and typical opponents.
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poker_pup
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 130
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Absent any reads, I fold flop and definitely fold turn.
The check raise on the flop shows strength. The big bet on the turn looks like he's protecting a good hand from a flush draw.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by poker_pup
Absent any reads, I fold flop and definitely fold turn.
The check raise on the flop shows strength. The big bet on the turn looks like he's protecting a good hand from a flush draw.
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I don't like a flop fold for almost 4 to 1 on this board. Hero's hand gets tons of equity from any Q, T or club (15 cards). Any A, K, J or 4 adds playability + equity, too (11 cards). When half the deck helps me, and 5 or fewer cards help my opponent (who can play this line with a variety of hands some of which I beat and others I'm not horribly behind), I'm not folding to this tiny raise.
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poker_pup
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 130
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
Quote:
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Originally Posted by poker_pup
Absent any reads, I fold flop and definitely fold turn.
The check raise on the flop shows strength. The big bet on the turn looks like he's protecting a good hand from a flush draw.
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I don't like a flop fold for almost 4 to 1 on this board. Hero's hand gets tons of equity from any Q, T or club (15 cards). Any A, K, J or 4 adds playability + equity, too (11 cards). When half the deck helps me, and 5 or fewer cards help my opponent (who can play this line with a variety of hands some of which I beat and others I'm not horribly behind), I'm not folding to this tiny raise. |
I see your point. There is a lot of cards that would help hero's hand on the turn. But there's only two cards that would make hero's hand better than a set of 4's. Betting pattern makes me think villian has a set of 4's.
Absent any reads, i play betting patterns. At this level, check raised flop usually means TPTK is beat. Hero's probably beat on the flop and without a good draw, so I'd fold.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by poker_pup
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
Quote:
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Originally Posted by poker_pup
Absent any reads, I fold flop and definitely fold turn.
The check raise on the flop shows strength. The big bet on the turn looks like he's protecting a good hand from a flush draw.
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I don't like a flop fold for almost 4 to 1 on this board. Hero's hand gets tons of equity from any Q, T or club (15 cards). Any A, K, J or 4 adds playability + equity, too (11 cards). When half the deck helps me, and 5 or fewer cards help my opponent (who can play this line with a variety of hands some of which I beat and others I'm not horribly behind), I'm not folding to this tiny raise. |
I see your point. There is a lot of cards that would help hero's hand on the turn. But there's only two cards that would make hero's hand better than a set of 4's. Betting pattern makes me think villian has a set of 4's.
Absent any reads, i play betting patterns. At this level, check raised flop usually means TPTK is beat. Hero's probably beat on the flop and without a good draw, so I'd fold. |
I'd fold the turn, but there's a ton of equity in seeing what the turn card is before folding. And he doesn't always have a set here, imo.
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
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from the best nl player in the world
-I had a pair and those are hard to get
-you can't win if you fold
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