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Too timid here?

  
 
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ponyboy
Old 09-17-2008, 04:36 PM     Post subject: Too timid here? #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 379
ponyboy
Villain is 1 hand raised preflop over only 9 hands seen. Should have probably raised 5-6x preflop but it was EP and at start of session.

Since he smooth called my bet on the flop (3/4 of pot) I thought check/folding here was the best play. Wrong? And if so, why?

PokerStars Game #20477841906: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2008/09/17 12:26:34 ET
Table 'Marfik' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: Speedwon5 ($4.71 in chips)
Seat 2: Deffs ($3.43 in chips)
Seat 3: Lady_B_Luck ($3.79 in chips)
Seat 4: copeton ($3.01 in chips)
Seat 5: Baggio16 ($1.98 in chips)
Seat 6: dan-neg47 ($4.76 in chips)
Seat 7: El_Gennaro ($1.15 in chips)
Seat 8: Kjellstedt ($3.27 in chips)
Seat 9: ponyfitness ($2.93 in chips)
Baggio16: posts small blind $0.01
dan-neg47: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ponyfitness [Qs Qh]
El_Gennaro: folds
Kjellstedt: folds
ponyfitness: raises $0.06 to $0.08
Speedwon5: calls $0.08
Deffs: folds
Lady_B_Luck: calls $0.08
copeton: folds
Baggio16: folds
dan-neg47: folds
*** FLOP *** [Kd 9h Td]
ponyfitness: bets $0.24
Speedwon5: folds
Lady_B_Luck: calls $0.24
*** TURN *** [Kd 9h Td] [7h]
ponyfitness: checks
Lady_B_Luck: bets $0.42
ponyfitness: folds
Uncalled bet ($0.42) returned to Lady_B_Luck
Lady_B_Luck collected $0.75 from pot
Lady_B_Luck: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $0.75 | Rake $0
Board [Kd 9h Td 7h]
Seat 1: Speedwon5 folded on the Flop
Seat 2: Deffs folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Lady_B_Luck collected ($0.75)
Seat 4: copeton (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Baggio16 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: dan-neg47 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 7: El_Gennaro folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: Kjellstedt folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: ponyfitness folded on the Turn
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wellrounded08
Old 09-17-2008, 07:58 PM     Post subject: Re: Too timid here? #2 (permalink)  
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wellrounded08
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponyboy
Villain is 1 hand raised preflop over only 9 hands seen. Should have probably raised 5-6x preflop but it was EP and at start of session.
I won't comment on the hand, Leave that to the better players.

However This statement caught my attention for two reasons.
1. Play the same throughout you're entire session. If you think you're being timid because it the start of your session, does that mean being Spewy at the end is ok? Playing a little extra tight when you first sit at a table is ok, cuz you have no reads. I could be wrong and will hopefully be corrected if so.

2.Raise 5-6xBB ??? Why??? does that mean you normally riase 10xBB with Aces? Great, tell me when ur next session starts I'll join you're tables. But seriously 4xBB+1per limper is Fine in ALL Positions. Otherwise, you end up raising big with Big hands, and raising small with small hands.=Obvious. Again, I Hope to be corrected if I'm wrong here, but I think this is the general rule.
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ponyboy
Old 09-17-2008, 08:08 PM     Post subject: Re: Too timid here? #3 (permalink)  
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ponyboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by wellrounded08
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponyboy
Villain is 1 hand raised preflop over only 9 hands seen. Should have probably raised 5-6x preflop but it was EP and at start of session.
I won't comment on the hand, Leave that to the better players.

However This statement caught my attention for two reasons.
1. Play the same throughout you're entire session. If you think you're being timid because it the start of your session, does that mean being Spewy at the end is ok? Playing a little extra tight when you first sit at a table is ok, cuz you have no reads. I could be wrong and will hopefully be corrected if so.

2.Raise 5-6xBB ??? Why??? does that mean you normally riase 10xBB with Aces? Great, tell me when ur next session starts I'll join you're tables. But seriously 4xBB+1per limper is Fine in ALL Positions. Otherwise, you end up raising big with Big hands, and raising small with small hands.=Obvious. Again, I Hope to be corrected if I'm wrong here, but I think this is the general rule.
Thanks for the comments. I usually play a little tighter for the first couple of orbits until I have a bit of a sense of what type of players I'm dealing with. Later on once I have seen 20-30 hands and made notes I have a better sense of who I'm up against after the flop and adjust accordingly.
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Robb
Old 09-17-2008, 08:20 PM     Post subject: Re: Too timid here? #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wellrounded08
However This statement caught my attention for two reasons.
1. Play the same throughout you're entire session. If you think you're being timid because it the start of your session, does that mean being Spewy at the end is ok? Playing a little extra tight when you first sit at a table is ok, cuz you have no reads. I could be wrong and will hopefully be corrected if so.
I disagree. There are times when we adjust our opening bet to 4 or 5 x BB +1 BB for limpers. I think OP is correct here, both with this bet and with a willingness later to increase it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wellrounded08
2.Raise 5-6xBB ??? Why??? does that mean you normally riase 10xBB with Aces? Great, tell me when ur next session starts I'll join you're tables. But seriously 4xBB+1per limper is Fine in ALL Positions. Otherwise, you end up raising big with Big hands, and raising small with small hands.=Obvious. Again, I Hope to be corrected if I'm wrong here, but I think this is the general rule.
No, we raise more if 3x raises aren't enough to thin the action (on hands we want to play heads up). There are games where 5x, 8x or even 10x standard opening raises are necessary, just so we're not playing 5-way on every flop. Besides, if you KNOW you're getting 2 callers and you're holding AK, why NOT bet 10x to open?

On the hand, I'm not laying this one down. Any Q, heart or J probably makes us a winner. Call turn, shove river if you hit, c/c or c/f if not.
My Operation and FTR Rethread: Stations are *sob* so hard to play against
 
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Old 09-18-2008, 01:44 AM     Post subject: Re: Too timid here? #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wellrounded08
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponyboy
Villain is 1 hand raised preflop over only 9 hands seen. Should have probably raised 5-6x preflop but it was EP and at start of session.
I won't comment on the hand, Leave that to the better players.

However This statement caught my attention for two reasons.
1. Play the same throughout you're entire session. If you think you're being timid because it the start of your session, does that mean being Spewy at the end is ok? Playing a little extra tight when you first sit at a table is ok, cuz you have no reads. I could be wrong and will hopefully be corrected if so.

2.Raise 5-6xBB ??? Why??? does that mean you normally riase 10xBB with Aces? Great, tell me when ur next session starts I'll join you're tables. :wink: But seriously 4xBB+1per limper is Fine in ALL Positions. Otherwise, you end up raising big with Big hands, and raising small with small hands.=Obvious. Again, I Hope to be corrected if I'm wrong here, but I think this is the general rule.
Well, just because you think you can read someone's hand by their raise amount doesn't mean it's true. If I want to raise more with my better hands I can, but all I have to do is raise 3x with aces once and showdown and you will no longer feel confident about your bet sizing reads anymore. See HOH about this.
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