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Standard hand #48763

  
 
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Fnord
Old 10-05-2008, 12:00 PM     Post subject: Standard hand #48763 #1 (permalink)  
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$1/$2 No Limit Holdem
PokerStars
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($212.40)
UTG+1 ($204.85)
CO ($210.65)
BTN ($231.00)
Hero ($254.85)
BB ($43.70)

Pre-flop: ($3, 6 players) Hero is SB
UTG raises to $7, UTG+1 calls $7, 1 fold, BTN calls $7, Hero raises to $32, 1 fold, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $25, BTN folds

Flop: ($80, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks

Turn: ($80, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks

River: ($80, 2 players)
Hero bets $30, UTG+1 raises to $82, Hero snap calls $52

Final Pot: $244
UTG+1 shows:
Hero shows:

Hero wins $241 ( won +$127 )
UTG lost -$7.00
UTG+1 lost -$114.00
BTN lost -$7.00

UTG+1 leaves the table
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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Clar17y
Old 10-05-2008, 12:38 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Cool.

Would I be wrong in c-betting this flop? We have the nut flush draw and a strong hand...

I'm guessing this is with reads that he'll bluff - raise rivers, but tbh it's a pretty bluffy line.

Clar
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Monty3038
Old 10-05-2008, 01:07 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Fnord, in my reading I'm seeing a lot of justification for the question Clar17y is putting to you... would C-betting be wrong here? It might reduce our overall value though, as with a C-bet to his underpair he might fold it off...
 
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Old 10-05-2008, 01:21 PM #4 (permalink)  
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checking the flop is the correct play IMO
 
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killerkebab
Old 10-05-2008, 02:49 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I think we don't cbet flop because there are no cards that 'scare' us. The ace is already there, which means we're either way ahead or way behind.
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Clar17y
Old 10-05-2008, 03:59 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killerkebab
I think we don't cbet flop because there are no cards that 'scare' us. The ace is already there, which means we're either way ahead or way behind.
This makes sense, and gives villain a chance to bluff us, but it displays weakness.
Wouldn't it be possible to be pushed off your hand if your villain had just bet flop and turn? What do we do if villain bets flop? What do we do if he bets flop and turn? What if he bets turn / river?

I think we can c/c a flop but if he fires again on the turn and we don't have the odds for our flush we've got to let it go. Plus sometimes I hate c/c since it just looks weak; you like your hand but you don't want to bet it, and good players might pick up on that.
If he checks flop but fires turn and river then I guess there's an argument for c/c both streets but in reality if it's a pot that's big enough to shove on the river I don't see how we can call?

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tom
Old 10-05-2008, 07:16 PM #7 (permalink)  
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I'm curious about the turn check, why not bet here?
 
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Fnord
Old 10-05-2008, 07:59 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clar17y
I'm guessing this is with reads that he'll bluff - raise rivers
Nope. Think about what he's trying to represent with his river raise.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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Old 10-05-2008, 08:02 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Fnord
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clar17y
I'm guessing this is with reads that he'll bluff - raise rivers
Nope. Think about what he's trying to represent with his river raise.
Yeah, he didn't represent an Ace or the Flush because a turn bet would have been in order. I assume he put you on big unpaired cards and thought you were buying the pot on the river = SNAP CALL
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a500lbgorilla
Old 10-05-2008, 08:49 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom
I'm curious about the turn check, why not bet here?
what calls? what raises? what folds?

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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tom
Old 10-05-2008, 10:54 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom
I'm curious about the turn check, why not bet here?
what calls? what raises? what folds?
worse pp's and worse flush draws are convinced to do a lot of c/c no?
flushes will either raise or c/r
not sure what hands in his range is folding
 
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Old 10-06-2008, 12:12 AM #12 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clar17y
I'm guessing this is with reads that he'll bluff - raise rivers
Nope. Think about what he's trying to represent with his river raise.
Yeah, he didn't represent an Ace or the Flush because a turn bet would have been in order. I assume he put you on big unpaired cards and thought you were buying the pot on the river = SNAP CALL
No, two big unpaired hands are behind his range, so he would just call. He assumed a second pair or a bigger pp that would fold to a river raise. Of course he didn't pick a good spot to do it since he can't have a better hand that didn't bet the turn.
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aka_red
Old 10-06-2008, 04:10 AM #13 (permalink)  
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Fnord, just because your plan was to 'induce' a bluff raise and it worked out that he didn't have, TT, Ax, T9, etc does not make this a super standard.
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