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Some 5nl spots halp

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JoeHaw

08-15-2009, 12:55 AM Post subject: Some 5nl spots halp

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

vpip/pfr/ats/3bet%/fold to 3bet
af/cbet/fold2cbet/coldcall/hands

HAND 1

$0.02/$0.05 No Limit Holdem
9 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG Espresso 24 ($4.88)
UTG+1 pokapoka36 ($5.22)
MP1 Hero ($5.00)
MP2 xKillyTheBit ($6.10)
MP3 angstrom_79 ($8.95)
CO rocketstunts ($9.73)
BTN cochecho6 ($5.20)
SB Freiherrr17 ($13.07)
BB carabus1 ($4.58)

Pre-flop: ($0.07, 9 players) Hero is MP1

2 folds, Hero raises to $0.20, 3 folds, cochecho6 raises to $0.80, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.60

I kind of want to fold pre. He's had 42 opportunities to 3bet according to HEM- and statistically if he was 3betting JJ+ AKs/o (You have a 3% chance of being dealt that range any single hand) than he would've made a 3bet by now. Even if he only 3bet KK+ and AKo AKs, there's a 87% chance he would've made a 3bet by now. If he 3bets AA KK and QQ there's a 55% chance he would've 3bet by now. Anyways, I feel like anytime a A or K doesn't flop I have to c/f and thats a lot of the time.

Flop:

($1.67, 2 players)
Hero checks, cochecho6 bets $2.10, Hero folds

Final Pot: $1.67

cochecho6 wins $3.72 ( won +$0.82 )
Hero lost -$0.80

So do you guys agree? Fold pre?

HAND 2

$0.02/$0.05 No Limit Holdem
9 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG duard56 ($10.22)
UTG+1 PeKePrO ($10.00)
MP1 Theta88 ($0.87)
MP2 enzymoro ($3.60)
MP3 maciekgsx ($11.90)
CO low66 ($4.88)
BTN Mik Gour. ($6.54)
SB Hero ($5.58)
BB Poky134 ($10.13)
[enzymoro posted $0.05]

Pre-flop: ($0.12, 9 players) Hero is SB

1 fold, PeKePrO raises to $0.15, 1 fold, enzymoro raises to $0.25, 3 folds, Hero calls $0.23, 1 fold, PeKePrO calls $0.10

I didn't like my odds against 2 randoms 4bet calling ranges even though the 3bet was tiny so I think this is okay.

Flop:

($0.80, 3 players)
Hero bets $0.60, PeKePrO folds, enzymoro calls $0.60

Pretty standard I think- 70c probably would've been better.

Turn:

($2, 2 players)
Hero checks, enzymoro bets $0.50, Hero?

The draw completes and an overcard comes that hits his range really hard. I don't put him on spade draws,is his range is pretty much AKs AKo AA and KK? The min3bet pre just has me really confused in terms of putting a range together because I feel like he might just have a normal opening hand but didn't like the 3x open the original raiser had. I'm getting 4:1 but that doesnt matter obviously if I have 0 equity. Is this a super easy fold? Can he ever not have a king and just be trying to take the pot since I checked?

HAND 3

$0.02/$0.05 No Limit Holdem
9 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG Hero ($8.26)
UTG+1 balaz76 ($5.57)
MP1 _Rman_X_ ($10.59)
MP2 stevo1964 ($10.21)
MP3 Raditz10 ($9.78)
CO low66 ($4.88)
BTN Pizola ($8.49)
SB PassTheSug06 ($1.37)
BB granaino96 ($5.56)

Pre-flop: ($0.07, 9 players) Hero is UTG

Hero raises to $0.20, 3 folds, Raditz10 calls $0.20, 4 folds

Flop:

($0.47, 2 players)
Hero bets $0.35, Raditz10 raises to $0.70, Hero calls $0.35

I've been getting a few people minraising my cbets recently, and I called instead of 3betting because I feel like most of the time worse kings aren't doing this, and his range is polarized into sets and bluffs.

Turn:

($1.87, 2 players)
Hero bets $1.60, Raditz10 folds

If I put him on a bluff I think I need to check to him here, right? I don't want him getting a free card but I alreadly gave him one in the hopes of earning an extra bet and I think I screwed that up really bad.

Final Pot: $1.87

Hero wins $3.42 ( won +$0.92 )
Raditz10 lost -$0.90

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nish81

08-15-2009, 11:23 AM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jun 2009

Posts: 295

hand 1:
I think 42 hands is too small of a sample to gauge what he's 3betting with it. I mean, your percentages might be correct, but think of the huge variance with such a tiny sample. Also, 1/3 of the time there will be a flop that hits your AKo (according to another thread I read here)

hand 2:
I'm not sure about preflop. I'd probably do the same as you but I have a feeling that a 4bet for isolation might be correct, dunno about their calling ranges though. as for turn, I either check/fold or bet/fold since I dont think he's bluffing this turn. oh but wait that's a pretty small bet. not so sure now, maybe you could try to take it to a cheap showdown?

hand 3:
er, I'll pass and let you get advice from someone who's prolly right

<JustinSKS> Tha'ts why I fold my 33 to 72o, because 7 high beats, 1 pair, donk.

JR: lets do it JUAN
JR: mono e mono
JR: man to man
JR: HU4ROLLZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Dealer: juan0984 folds

PhilMC

08-15-2009, 12:21 PM

#3 (permalink)

Join Date: Apr 2009

Posts: 22

first hand is ok, no way I am folding AK to 3bet.. on the flop I either b/f or c/f, since he missed with his range many times, but he can be easily holding an overpair...
second hand: limping after a 3bet with ladies? youre asking for trouble... first player is dead money, but with such a small raise, he is getting nice odds even with ATC... just raise it and dont give and dont overestimate his range...
last hand is fine with with me, pot is big enough to be taken down right away and with a bet like this, you can easily tell a set from a bluff...

JoeHaw

08-15-2009, 04:51 PM

#4 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

What range to you guys put him on preflop? If you put him on JJ+ AKs AKo, than I hit an A or a K even less often than 1/3 and when I do I'm behind or tied w/ his range almost half the time.

6 JJ
6 QQ
3 KK
3 AA
9 AK

If an A or K DOESNT hit than I'm behind more than half of his range and a cbet likely won't take it down.

Obviously I must be doing SOMETHING wrong otherwise people wouldn't play AK against JJ+ AK ever, but keep in mind I think it's likely his range is smaller than that anyways.

I'm a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it.
-Thomas Jefferson

Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.
-Thomas Edison

linaker

08-15-2009, 09:26 PM

#5 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2009

Location: UK

Posts: 70

Hand 1: You are getting the right price to call preflop with AK against a QQ+, AK range, but that does not make the flop easy to play, if you fear KK and AA are a big part of his range. You don't have a big sample of his hands, but you have to go on the information you have and after 64 hands his VPIP is 14 and his PFR is 3. This is not a maniac who is 3 betting 94o. You are OOP and his range could be as tight as KK+. I would fold.

Hand 2: Tiny 3 bets often seem to be AA or KK trying not to lose custom or medium pairs trying to "define their hand". I would be inclined to make a decent 4bet pre-flop.

I think your KK+, AK range on the turn is too tight. QQ, TT, 99 and AT+ also make sense because of the straight possiblilities.

Hand 3: In hindsight checking the turn probably would have been better, as there are few cards that can worry you on the river.

JoeHaw

08-15-2009, 10:19 PM

#6 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

I don't understand how I am getting the right price against QQ+, AK

linaker

08-15-2009, 10:31 PM

#7 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2009

Location: UK

Posts: 70

When its your turn to act, the pot is $1.07. You need to call 60c, so you need equity of 60/1.67 x 100 = 35.9% or better to make a call correct. Against QQ+, AKo, your equity is 38.8%.

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 38.824% 18.14% 20.68% 78295380 89232168.00 { AKo }
Hand 1: 61.176% 40.50% 20.68% 174740892 89232168.00 { QQ+, AKs, AKo }

JoeHaw

08-15-2009, 10:35 PM

#8 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

That's assuming I get to showdown w/o having to pay any more money...
I'm hitting an A or K on the flop less than 1/3 and when I do I might be behind

linaker

08-15-2009, 11:02 PM

#9 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2009

Location: UK

Posts: 70

Yes, the call is correct in isolation. But in this spot, the flop is very hard to play, unless it is QJT rainbow. Even if it was AKK, you could be behind. Thats why I said I would have folded.

JoeHaw

08-16-2009, 04:45 AM

#10 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

How is the call correct in isolation? I really don't understand

JKDS

08-16-2009, 05:50 AM

#11 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Feb 2008

Location: Chandler, AZ

Posts: 1,024

of the options to shove, raise, call, and fold, calling is without a doubt, the worst option. No initiative, less chances to hit without putting money in, oop, bad equity, so no reason to call.

id say folding is def the safest and against someone whom u have no idea what hes doing its prob best considering all the above reasons and the problems with the below options.

shoving seems bad because his continuing range is like AK, QQ+ probably. Its not as terrible as calling though because we block the stronger part of his range, wont fold to a cb from ak, and flip with the rest and the dead money is probably enough to justify it. If AQ is there, then we just went to +ev. And additionally, villain will occasionally make a mistake and fold QQ, or JJ. Its higher variance even if all the above is true though cuz obv we're flipping for stacks. we're still practically flipping though, so prob option number 2

4betting a standard amount im mixed on. Some villains will split their range into call=qq,jj,ako raise=aks,kk+ but this doesnt really seem good for us. if they call, we need to hit because qq,jj never folds to a flop bet, and if they raise we have less equity now than if we just shoved.

so i like fold>shove>>>raise>call.

h2: the only flush draw he should ever have is AsQs. its doubtful he 3bets the min with that though. im thinking his min3b range is something like 99-QQ. obv its an unknown...but hands like AK or AQ raise larger because noobs are afraid of them and want to keep ppl out...hands like AA and KK might do it...but in general i think its mostly a scaredy "where am i at?" kind of bet. im not sure if i 4b here though.

with that in mind, im not folding. id be pretty wary of spade rivers though but also expect him to check behind alot except for the only qq combo he can have.

h3: ya, villain effectively just said "either i have a strong hand, or i have air". strong is like KQ and better though (not entirely sure he does this with KQ but its there at least some percent of the time).

because of this...if we call then i think we're check/calling the rest of the hand.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OngBonga

But no, jkds is lolvillager and anyone who wants to string him up is sighbad.

JoeHaw

08-16-2009, 07:01 AM

#12 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: IL

Posts: 186

ahhh thank you for the analysis- that all makes perfect sense to me.

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Some 5nl spots halp

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