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some 5NL hands

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Keith

03-08-2009, 12:46 AM Post subject: some 5NL hands

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2008

Posts: 1,336

Villain was 10 /7 over 95 hands.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($5.05)
BB ($5)
UTG ($10.67)
MP ($18.22)
CO ($11.71)
Hero (Button) ($6.40)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J

, J

1 fold, MP bets $0.20, CO raises to $0.60, Hero calls $0.60, SB calls $0.58, 2 folds

Flop: ($2.05) 9

, 3

, 9

(3 players)
SB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $1.50, 1 fold, CO raises to $11.11 (All-In), Hero ????

I was putting him on 88+,AQs+,AQo+. when he shoved I figured that I was roughly a coin flip and being offered nearly 2:1 on it.Is this valid?.

Hand 2.
villain was 24/18/3 over 215 hands with a 9% 3bet %. ANy time I'd raised from the small blind he'd allways 3bet and I'd had to fold.I'd seen him showdown J9s,T9o,QJo,QTo,AJoand Q9s.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Hero (SB) ($6.01)
BB ($10.66)
UTG ($12.39)
MP ($10.21)
CO ($10.03)
Button ($5.11)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J

, J

4 folds, Hero bets $0.25, BB raises to $0.75, Hero calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.50) 2

, 5

, 4

(2 players)
Hero bets $1, BB raises to $2, Hero ???

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xpaand

03-08-2009, 03:57 AM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Mar 2009

Location: Vancouver

Posts: 289

Oh those are some tough ones. Free bump cause I really want some expert opinions on these two hands. I have NO idea what the right play is!

OP: Beginner to Master

If I bet as a bluff, I should be thinking "am I getting better hands to fold? Is it likely that he will fold x% of the time to a y sized bet to make it +EV?". If I bet for value, I should be thinking "am I getting worst hands to call? Am I ahead of enough of his range that this is a good value bet?".

kettleofish

03-08-2009, 04:14 AM

#3 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Helllllo Richard

Posts: 333

Hand 1: Have u seen mr tighty 3 bet before? It's a close call against a tight range. We need to win roughly 31.5% of the time to break even on a call, and against a range of TT+,AcKc we have 32.2% equity.

Hand 2: I would 4 bet to $2ish preflop with the intention of calling a shove against this guy, or check/shove any non ace flop in the unlikely event of him flatting the 4 bet.

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Micro2Macro

03-08-2009, 04:30 AM

#4 (permalink)

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Hand 1 I think is a fold against this nitty of a guy. (btw who the fuck runs 10/7 at 6-max)

Hand 2 I probably 4-bet oop like kettleofish stated because I hate calling 3-bets oop. An ace, king, or queen is flopping alot of the time, so if you 4-bet you'll either get him to fold alot, or if he calls, c-bet flop depending on the board texture unless he's only flatting 4-bets with nut hands. He seems like he might do this sometimes just because of his stats - he's looking like a tricky type to me for some reason.

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Illfavor

03-08-2009, 05:36 AM

#5 (permalink)

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Location: Denton, TX

Posts: 1,152

In H1 did you have a plan when you coldcalled the 3bet of the nit? Are we really looking to stack off against him on most flops?

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ATOTHEC101

03-08-2009, 05:59 AM

#6 (permalink)

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Join Date: May 2008

Posts: 1,248

hand 1 fold.

hand 2: 4 bet to $2/ get it in pre. As played im flatting this minraise and getting it in on any non 3, ace or king turn though shoving is fine too.

03-08-2009, 08:52 AM

#7 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

In hand 1 you HAVE TO split his range into two parts:
bluffs and value
you can't put him on shoving AQ EVERY SINGLE TIME
we group his AQ/AK type of hands together into his bluffs
we group 99+ into his value range (possible A9s, 9Ts, 89s and 33 if 3bs light IP)

now we see we're in deep shit against his value range so he has to be bluffing a certain % of the time
if he's a person that never bluffs it's a fold
if he's a person that often bluffs it's a fold
if he's a person that ALWAYS shoves overcards on this board it's call

hand 2, blind vs. blind yeah I get this in preflop he has hands like 99, TT in his preflop stack off range if he's aggressive and possibly hands like AJ
then I get this in on the flop I think he can semibluff two overcards + gutshot easily since it's ten outs

XTR1000

03-08-2009, 01:31 PM

#8 (permalink)

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XTR1000 is an unknown quantity at this point

#1 Your range for a 7% opener who has 3bet is way off. Unless MP is huge donator who rarely 4bets preflop is close imo. As played u gotta fold flop.

#2 Given dynamic 4bet/get it in pre. If someones 3betting u a bunch in bvb u have to open 4betting ranges and tighten opening ranges. As played 3bet flop and call it off.

Quote:

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Keith

03-08-2009, 01:46 PM

#9 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2008

Posts: 1,336

Quote:

In H1 did you have a plan when you coldcalled the 3bet of the nit? Are we really looking to stack off against him on most flops?

hand 1 I can't remember him 3 betting, and to be totally honest I called in the hope that SB as the original raiser would be coming along as well potentially building a decent pot for set value. If SB had raised I was planning to fold as I thought that I'd then probably be behind both of them.
when they both cheked the flop, I was thinking it was maybe lower pair in the SB and the range i originally said for BB and quite possibly in the AK AQ part of his range. I'm not sure whether I should have checked behind on the flop,or just shoved though as his check raise effectively gave the odds to call on the range I was putting him on, and if he was in the AK AQ part of his range he may well have folded and if he was AA KK QQ then I was going to be stuffed anyway unless i fluked a J on turn/river.

hand 2. I wasn't sure whether JJ is strong enough hand preflop in this situation to 4bet with and since he had been 3 betting me a lot i figured that he was probably 3 betting light but it was probably an Ax Kx Qx or pp hand he had. I checked behind and the plan was then to shove any non A or K flops. and probably have tried to cbet a Qxx flop. edit: forgot to say that when that actual flp came I figured that potentially any of his Ax hands now had a straight draw so went for the cbet. I took his raise as probably being overcards and still trying to push me off the pot so shoved all in.

4betting is something I've very rarely done as I've found that generally down here at 5NL any 3 bets are usually AA or KK or AK . I didn't put him on this range simply because of the frequency with which he had 3 bet my blind steals and I now had a hand that i felt was worth playing back at me. This is still a bit of a learning curve for me calling/shoving when possibly behind because I thought I had the pot odds so I wanted to check that my logic was correct.

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